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elieb
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Post subject: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recievers Posted: 12 Mar 2013, 23:01 |
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Joined: 18 Mar 2011, 22:12 Posts: 909 Location: Windsor, Ontario, Canada Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 2 times
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i was wondering do any Cinema Digital Sound decoders exist for hearing CDS/DCS mixes as they should--on a real dcs decoder, or will dolby pro logic II sound the same? feel free to expand this short lived kodac sound system. http://in70mm.com/library/process/cds/index.htm
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disclord
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 13 Mar 2013, 20:39 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2010, 21:12 Posts: 1616 Location: Plattsburg, Missouri. USA Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 11 times
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tim_p wrote: Having had a poke around film-tech, in70mm, imdb and of course lddb I've summarised the CDS mixed films on home video and am wondering what's what. I can see something like T2 being too much of a temptation to remix hence, per your posts disclord, it's the original Artisan dvd that is required but what about mix sources for the others bearing in mind that not every film was a six-track/5.1 mix?
Straightforward Terminator 2 - original Artisan dvd CDS 5.1 mix Dick Tracy - blu ray is lossless version of CDS 5.1 dvd mix? Days of Thunder - as above? The Doors - blu ray is some 7.1 abomination, so it's the AC3 laser or 5.1 dvd for CDS?
Not so straightforward Edward Scissorhands - blu ray is 4.0 and laser is Dolby Surround - CDS or Dolby SR? Hudson Hawk - laser is Dolby Surround and dvd is DD 2.0 so CDS or Dolby SR? For the Boys - as above plus dvd has a 'new' 4.1 mix - who knows?! Final Approach - Dolby Surround on laser only so CDS or Dolby SR? Flatliners - no CDS theatrical release in the US so the 5.1 mix on blu would (still) be CDS sourced, 70mm 6-track sourced or new mix for home video? Laser is Dolby Surround and dvd is DD 2.0. Universal Soldier - as above but no 70mm 6-track so CDS or new 5.1 mix for laser, dvd and blu? A number of the CDS films were 4.0 mixes, like The Doors and Edward Scissorhands and the DVD's replicate that. For the Boys was a 4.1 CDS mix. A number of the CDS films were mixed for Dolby Stereo release so had 4 track discrete master mixes and the CDS was a last minute change. Even titles like Waterworld were not 5.1 theatrically in DTS - it was 5.0 and some were 4.0. So, 4.0, 4.1 and 5.1 are all represented in CDS mixes and some have been transferred correctly to disc - others have had remixes. I dont know about all the titles - just the ones I enquired about back when they had their original DVD releases. BTW, CDS was a lossless system - although it used compression, it used a custom delta modulation PCM system with a bit rate of just over 5mbps on film. It was the highest quality of all the film formats.
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disclord
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 14 Mar 2013, 02:07 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2010, 21:12 Posts: 1616 Location: Plattsburg, Missouri. USA Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 11 times
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elieb wrote: so if i used dolby digital, it would sound the same, opposed to the 3 modes on the sony? The modes on the Sony are NOT Cinema Digital Sound. They are Digital Cinema Sound, Sony's trademark for their DSP systems that screw with the sound. They have NOTHING to do with each other.
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laserbite34
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 14 Mar 2013, 06:48 |
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Joined: 10 Oct 2006, 17:10 Posts: 3742 Location: United Kingdom Has thanked: 5 times Been thanked: 4 times
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disclord wrote: elieb wrote: so if i used dolby digital, it would sound the same, opposed to the 3 modes on the sony? The modes on the Sony are NOT Cinema Digital Sound. They are Digital Cinema Sound, Sony's trademark for their DSP systems that screw with the sound. They have NOTHING to do with each other. I could have easily said that in my sleep. Also it has nothing to do with SDDS it has nothing to do with SDDS.
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sartana
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 02 Nov 2013, 09:44 |
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Joined: 10 May 2011, 14:19 Posts: 9 Location: United States Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 0 time
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disclord wrote: BTW, CDS was a lossless system - although it used compression, it used a custom delta modulation PCM system with a bit rate of just over 5mbps on film. It was the highest quality of all the film formats.
Although I agree CDS was the highest quality of all film formats including SDDS, I am not sure if it was %100 lossless. On the other hand, Strong International had developed a digital soundtrack which was a dual system with the sound being on Laserdiscs and they claimed it was the only true CD quality linear soundtrack. The people who heard it confirmed that it was even more impressive than CDS. Unfortunately "Strong Digital" never managed to get any titles and the project was laid to rest.
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signofzeta
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 16 Dec 2014, 19:54 |
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Joined: 14 Jan 2010, 09:44 Posts: 5985 Location: Ann Arbor Has thanked: 1292 times Been thanked: 1105 times
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disclord wrote: CDS was just a method of putting digital sound on a print and not a system ever meant for home use. Many AC-3 LaserDisc's and DVD's use the 5.1 mix that was used for the CDS prints. Dick Tracy and The Doors and the first DVD release of T2 (and the AC-3 LD's ) all use the mix done for the CDS system. So again, it's not needed as we already have the CDS mixes available.
And Pro Logic II is a 2 channel decoding matrix system, not a discrete format so it can't ever recreate the same effects as a discrete system.
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elieb
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 16 Dec 2014, 22:53 |
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Joined: 18 Mar 2011, 22:12 Posts: 909 Location: Windsor, Ontario, Canada Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 2 times
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signofzeta wrote: disclord wrote: CDS was just a method of putting digital sound on a print and not a system ever meant for home use. Many AC-3 LaserDisc's and DVD's use the 5.1 mix that was used for the CDS prints. Dick Tracy and The Doors and the first DVD release of T2 (and the AC-3 LD's ) all use the mix done for the CDS system. So again, it's not needed as we already have the CDS mixes available.
And Pro Logic II is a 2 channel decoding matrix system, not a discrete format so it can't ever recreate the same effects as a discrete system. let me put it this way: does Doors, The (1991) [PSE96-080]which has the cds mix, is also the same on Doors, The (1991) [PSE96-77]? because i don't know which one to buy. elie
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elieb
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Post subject: Re: Cinema Digital Sound aka kodac and found on sony recieve Posted: 18 Dec 2014, 01:23 |
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Joined: 18 Mar 2011, 22:12 Posts: 909 Location: Windsor, Ontario, Canada Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 2 times
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blam1 wrote: Both of the Pioneer Special Edition versions of "The Doors" were derived from the same audio master. thank you very much, that's what i was looking for.
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