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 Post subject: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan LD
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2017, 02:28 
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For years I refused to watch anything post 1995 of the original Star Wars Trilogy. Foward to 2004/11; Even I bought the dvd box set September '04 knowing they would be the SE's. Then we slowly started to realize the color grading was all off. Then comes Harmy's awesome totally awesome DeSpecalized versions.

Earlier this year for fun I started working on my own Semi De-Specialized version of ESB using the '11 BD (before I had Harmy's version). I knew I'd never top or even match Harmy's. Video editing, capturing, vinyl digitizing is a hobby of mine.

I had a hellava time color grading the Hoth scenes. I color matched using the '89 Special Widescreen Edition LD and the '06 GOUT dvd.

So finally I got my hands on Harmy's version and wow......First off it looked incredible. But second, I was shocked as to how "blue" the Hoth scenes looked. I thought that was only on the 04/11 versions. Then I bought the '97 Japan Special Edition box set. Transfer looked wayyyy cleaner than the 89/93/95, even the 87 JSC. But I was shocked again.......blue Hoth.

Is the blue-ish Hoth the correct color grading? Sort-of like the scene in Episode 4 were R2 is in the valley at dusk with the Jawas. And on the P&S version it looks like daytime but I guess it's been said that that is not the correct grading....
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2017, 03:38 
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It’s been a while since we had one of these Star Wars maniac threads.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2017, 04:34 
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Did Julien remove the "risk" threads???
I think this should be under that, or start a new risk topic and the headphone guy can be in that topic also.

And not being a SW freak, I really love how all these "FanBoys" think they can do a better job than the guy and film company who made the film in the first place.
Or like they will get some type of job due to how good a job they did bootlegging a film for what "they" want to see.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2017, 06:03 
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I don’t think it’s about “better”, I think it’s just about being in on the edit as if you were part of Star Wars.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2017, 23:03 
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Oh, yeah that too.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 02:03 
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rein-o wrote:
Did Julien remove the "risk" threads???
I think this should be under that, or start a new risk topic and the headphone guy can be in that topic also.

And not being a SW freak, I really love how all these "FanBoys" think they can do a better job than the guy and film company who made the film in the first place.
Or like they will get some type of job due to how good a job they did bootlegging a film for what "they" want to see.


Not sure who Headphone Guy is?

What does Risk Thread mean?

Maybe you didn't read where I said it's a hobby of mine?

If you're not a Star Wars OT freak, why insult me with your reply to this post?
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 02:17 
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I don’t understand the last question.

Every once in a while we get someone who’s completely obsessed with Star Wars and building new HD edits from blurry old LDs. That guy never learns anything from us because he’s already 1000x more of a Star Wars fan than anyone here and usually doesn’t have much interest in LD so he goes away.

Some people have theorized its the same guy every time but that would be CRAZY, right? You weren’t just here talking about the same thing like nine months ago, were you?
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 04:49 
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Don't forget the guy who was obsessed with Drunken Master, he wanted to remake the film with all sources, VHS, Beta, LD DVD and Bluray :crazy:

And I do own star wars on LD, only had it since 1989 or 1990.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 06:11 
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rein-o wrote:
Don't forget the guy who was obsessed with Drunken Master, he wanted to remake the film with all sources, VHS, Beta, LD DVD and Bluray :crazy:


Yeah, there is a certain camp who feel that every movie should be as long as possible and that if any footage exists anywhere it needs to all go into one mega cut that will be better than all other cuts. As a huge fan of DM II its my opinion that every cut I've seen of it could probably stand to be a little shorter. :)
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 07:46 
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clashradio wrote:
For years I refused to watch anything post 1995 of the original Star Wars Trilogy. Foward to 2004/11; Even I bought the dvd box set September '04 knowing they would be the SE's. Then we slowly started to realize the color grading was all off. Then comes Harmy's awesome totally awesome DeSpecalized versions.

Earlier this year for fun I started working on my own Semi De-Specialized version of ESB using the '11 BD (before I had Harmy's version). I knew I'd never top or even match Harmy's. Video editing, capturing, vinyl digitizing is a hobby of mine.

I had a hellava time color grading the Hoth scenes. I color matched using the '89 Special Widescreen Edition LD and the '06 GOUT dvd.

So finally I got my hands on Harmy's version and wow......First off it looked incredible. But second, I was shocked as to how "blue" the Hoth scenes looked. I thought that was only on the 04/11 versions. Then I bought the '97 Japan Special Edition box set. Transfer looked wayyyy cleaner than the 89/93/95, even the 87 JSC. But I was shocked again.......blue Hoth.

Is the blue-ish Hoth the correct color grading? Sort-of like the scene in Episode 4 were R2 is in the valley at dusk with the Jawas. And on the P&S version it looks like daytime but I guess it's been said that that is not the correct grading....


It's hard to say what the "correct" color grading is for the Hoth scenes. It seems like it's gotten a bit more blue with each release starting around the time of the Faces / Definitive Collection laserdisc releases (although there is still some debate about it over at originaltrilogy.com).

Speaking of which, if you're not already on the forums at originaltrilogy.com (and I wouldn't be surprised if you already are), I highly recommend them. Seems like it would be right up your alley!
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 10:52 
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Apologies to clashradio for the dickish responses you've received so far. Nice to see 808state actually trying to address his questions rather than hurling insults at him.

What's happened to this forum lately? It's becoming a really unpleasant place to hang out rather than the fun place to discuss all things laserdisc (and beyond) it used to be.

How many threads do we have with people obsessing over video quality; the best players, comb filters, CRT vs LED vs Plasma etc? No different from obsessing over different versions of a film to me.

Anyway, welcome to the forum, clashradio, I hope your early experiences here don't put you off for life.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2017, 23:37 
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hippiedalek wrote:
Apologies to clashradio for the dickish responses you've received so far. Nice to see 808state actually trying to address his questions rather than hurling insults at him.

What's happened to this forum lately? It's becoming a really unpleasant place to hang out rather than the fun place to discuss all things laserdisc (and beyond) it used to be.

How many threads do we have with people obsessing over video quality; the best players, comb filters, CRT vs LED vs Plasma etc? No different from obsessing over different versions of a film to me.

Anyway, welcome to the forum, clashradio, I hope your early experiences here don't put you off for life.


Thank you hippiedalek.
Most everyone here has been helpful; especially substance (Mahir) and krbahr (Kurtis). Yes I do belong to Original Trilogy.com. But they kind-of beat a person up for doing a project like this as well because it's already been done. I'm not trying to re-invent the wheel. But it doesn't matter to me that years ago there was a project called "Star Wars X0" or "Harmy's De-Specialized versions". I want to do this myself because it's fun for me. I'm just now learning about proper transfers, comb filters, IVTC, hd capture devices. I know....I'm years behind, have been all my life.

I have to admit, with dvd's, and especially blu-rays people look at me and say "laserdisc?????wtf! are you stupid or something". In doing research about "best way to capture laserdisc" You know how many posts I've ran across where people say "you're kidding right" or "I'd never spend money on a LD in the 21st Century". I understand this is a niche format, sort-of like the Hipsters with their cassettes. But where else and who else am I going to be able to talk about Star Wars and/or SW laserdiscs ...oh I know, a forum dedicated to the format itself :D

Thank you hippiedalek for understanding about obsessing over quality, or a movie/band itself. I also transfer vinyl to cd because certain records will never be on cd. You can only get so much water out of a LD. So why not get the most out of it with a HLD-X0, a Lumagen 2144, (although I'm still not sure which capture device I want to use). And I admit if the original Star Wars Trilogy was released on BD, there probably would be the obsessiveness of fans, myself included. And no need to collect every laserdisc release of Star Wars (some for widescreen, some for the original audio track, some for a different transfer etc).

I only joined this site about two months ago. So whoever the Headphone Guy freak is, it ain't me. But I do admit to being a Star Wars Original Trilogy freak (except for Jedi; that's a terrible, terrible movie).

I take the risk of being humiliated by telling people what I want to do with video editing (even though it's already been done). But "I" haven't done it.

Jason
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 00:14 
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Obsessing over a film, player or TV set is one thing.
Trying to be a new cinematographer or film editor of an existing film is an entirely different story.

Also what is mentioned by good ole clash is also know as copyright infringement and where are the Disney police?????

Another note, this site is about collecting LDs and enjoying them not about how to copy a few films and then to dump the crappy old player.
Right?????
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 03:25 
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We may have misjudged this guy but if you’ve been on the forum long enough you know there is a certain refugee type from the “original trilogy” scene that seems to want to come here and talk our heads off about Star Wars. Not LD, Star Wars specifically. Presumably there are too many people like them on their own forum for the refugee to feel important or noticed there so he swims over to this smaller pond so things can be more about them. Maybe this isn’t that guy. Maybe LD exists as a fascinating movie format with tens of thousands of titles to him and not just as a 12” disc made to play 17 different cuts of Star Wars. I guess we’ll know when he starts a thread about something that isn’t Star Wars. Perhaps that has already happened and I didn’t notice.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 03:34 
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rein-o wrote:
Obsessing over a film, player or TV set is one thing.
Trying to be a new cinematographer or film editor of an existing film is an entirely different story.

Also what is mentioned by good ole clash is also know as copyright infringement and where are the Disney police?????

Another note, this site is about collecting LDs and enjoying them not about how to copy a few films and then to dump the crappy old player.
Right?????


These films are not on BD or even dvd, unless you count the 2006 limited edition dvd versions which were really just the 1993 videotape master used to make the Ld's. But even those aren't original as those have the 1993 audio mix.

It's not illegal to transfer your own media to a more modern source as long as it's not distributed, or shown in public. How does Harmy get away with it?... because they own all of the original releases. So do I.

I own:
-the 1977 super 8 Ken Films
-1982 CED
-1985 P&S LD
-1989/92 Special Widescreen Editions LD
-1991 Japan LD
-1993 LD DC set
-95 Faces LD + vhs
-86/87 JSC LD
-97 SE Japan LD
-soundtracks, books etc.
-2004/11 dvd/BD
-2006 re-issue dvd's w/unaltered editons
Not to mention Force Awakens, Rough One. And who knows what else I forgot to list.

Who said anything about dumping my crappy HLD-X0, CLD-99 or CLD-D703? Lumagen HDQ and soon a 2144.

Your hobby might just be to watch movies on your player, and that's cool. One of my hobbies is video editing. Doesn't seem so destructive to me. Ya I make Fan Edits too. I made one of The Force Awakens and I'm pretty proud of it. Cut out all the Guardians of the Galaxy-type cheese humor.

https://youtu.be/PeHGEVbMatg
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 03:43 
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You’re proud of what exactly?

Btw, do you own any movies that aren’t a version of Star Wars?
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 03:59 
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signofzeta wrote:
You’re proud of what exactly?

Btw, do you own any movies that aren’t a version of Star Wars?


Have you seen The Force Awakens? but I guess if you like Guardians of the Galaxy-type/Marvel-type humor then I guess you won't get it. Like I said it's a hobby. I probably wouldn't bash on you if you told me your hobby.

While I admit most of my LD's are Star Wars I do own a few others:

-THX-1138 US and Japan
-Terminator
-American Graffiti
-Ace Ventura
-Beatles/Doors/Who/Thin Lizzy tons of other music LD's that will never be on dvd/BD.


Last edited by clashradio on 07 Dec 2017, 14:40, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 06:15 
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No. I've only seen the Original Trilogy and 1.5 of those things they made in the 90s. I stop watching things when they stay too bad for too long. Regardless, I don't really see myself taking pride in editing someone else's $200M work without their permission for an audience of zero no matter what the movie is. What else are you proud of? Your patience with me is fairly impressive, that's something to be proud of.

Maybe the problem is me. I'm not sure I've ever said "I'm proud of..." in my life. Maybe I've known too many proud people and its too hard for me to separate arrogance from pride, or pride from undeserved pride. Maybe I'm stunted.
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 14:31 
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signofzeta wrote:
No. I've only seen the Original Trilogy and 1.5 of those things they made in the 90s. I stop watching things when they stay too bad for too long. Regardless, I don't really see myself taking pride in editing someone else's $200M work without their permission for an audience of zero no matter what the movie is. What else are you proud of? Your patience with me is fairly impressive, that's something to be proud of.

Maybe the problem is me. I'm not sure I've ever said "I'm proud of..." in my life. Maybe I've known too many proud people and its too hard for me to separate arrogance from pride, or pride from undeserved pride. Maybe I'm stunted.


Well, I'm definitely not arrogant. For me the The Force Awakens had so many good moments/scenes, but in my opinion had too many moments of cheese. But you know what they say about opinions....

I wouldn't say an audience of zero.. You must have not clicked on the YouTube link.

Don't know why you're getting upset that I did a Fan Edit. Was it your movie that I edited out all the cheese and comic relief??
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 Post subject: Re: I've never seen the '97 Star Wars SE's- until now Japan
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2017, 16:04 
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Copy is copying and is copyright infringement.
Words kind of go together.

I think the guy who was doing Drunken Master was trying to put every second of cheese back in...
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