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Which title(s) should be processed first? (choose up to 3)
 Alaska: Last Frontier (1994) [00MW-0008]  3%  3%  [ 2 ]
 Atlantis (1991) [PILH-1003]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Back to the Future (1985) [PA-HD80196]  7%  7%  [ 4 ]
 Back to the Future Part II (1989) [PA-HD80914]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Back to the Future Part III (1990) [PA-HD80976]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Basic Instinct (1992) (Uncut) [PILH-1002]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Bram Stoker's Dracula (1992) [HVMC-14590]  5%  5%  [ 3 ]
 Bugsy (1991) [HVMC-13645]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Chaplin (1992) [PILH-1005]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Cliffhanger (1993) [PILH-1007]  3%  3%  [ 2 ]
 Close Encounters of the Third Kind: Special Edition (1980) [HVMC-10003]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Dances with Wolves (1990) (Uncut) [PILH-7001]  5%  5%  [ 3 ]
 E.T. (1982) [PA-HD77012]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Ferrari of the Art [COLE-50004]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Guyana - The Lost World [00MW-0016]  3%  3%  [ 2 ]
 In the Line of Fire (1993) [HVMC-19668]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Jurassic Park (1993) [PA-HD82061]  13%  13%  [ 8 ]
 Katie & Marielle Labeque: The Loves of Emma Bardac [SRLM 1067]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Lawrence of Arabia (1962) [HVMC-12058]  3%  3%  [ 2 ]
 League of Their Own, A (1992) [HVMC-14589]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Legends of the Fall (1994) [HVMC-21588]  5%  5%  [ 3 ]
 Maeda - Hills of the Seasons (1990) [00MW-0005]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Musee du Louvre 2 [ICHL-0002]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Pictures at an Exhibition, Solti CSO [SRLM 1068]  3%  3%  [ 2 ]
 Pioneer: Hi-Vision LD Demonstration Disc (1993) [HE-100]  10%  10%  [ 6 ]
 Silence of the Lambs, The (1991) [HVMC-12819]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Sleepless in Seattle (1993) [HVMC-19799]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Song of Africa (1997) [00MW-0014]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Sony: The Test Disc (1995) [00MW-0009]  8%  8%  [ 5 ]
 Stargate (1994) [PILH-1008]  5%  5%  [ 3 ]
 Terminator 2: Judgment Day (1991) [PILH-1001]  12%  12%  [ 7 ]
 Top Gun (1986) [PA-HD71692]  2%  2%  [ 1 ]
 Universal Soldier (1992) [PILH-1004]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
 Wolf (1994) [HVMC-18647]  0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 60

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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 14 Dec 2015, 23:46 
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substance wrote:
how many jigs do you think 1 hour NTSC video would take in Uncompressed 4:4:4 in quicktime (using Mac)?


Way too much (for NTSC HD 1080i). You're not going to gain anything going this route. 4:2:2 is more than enough, and what i used when I did my captures (I did approximately 10 or so MUSE LDs).

And hard drive space is the least of your problems. You need high sustained writing ability. I was (thankfully) on an older Mac Pro tower able to capture about 45 minutes are so before the hard drives would begin to chug. But I ran 3 hard drives in a RAID0 config to obtain a decent write speed. Keep in mind, you need a SUSTAINED write speed, not peak.

Additionally, what I also found out was over/underscan on the capture presented some issues. Either way, for the movies, I (personally) wouldn't waste your time. To me, there's nothing that needs to be preserved here outside of pure curiosity for those that wondered about MUSE LD. The discs worth preserving are the numerous scenery discs to which hardly any were re-released in digital HD format (only aware of a few Sony titles that were).

If you want to have some "fun" - try and capture the decoded B-channel digitally or capture the decoded A-channel track, convert to a 5 channel digital track. I never got around to doing that for Tahiti.

Off top of my head, I have converted I think half a dozen NEC Fish club discs; Atlantis (which wasn't on Blue-Ray until recently); and scenery discs like Tahiti, Ferrari of the Art, Ordinary Europe, and I think a handful of other titles. They're all sitting on my server, and I watch them from time to time on a media player or PC.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2016, 17:14 
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I did a test run today. Captured the first 25 minutes of JP. I used the bmd intensity shuttle with my macbook pro. I used the media express software. It does accept and record in 1080i60. I couldn't record much because my macbook only has 256gb ssd.

Now I will try to convert to h.264 and burn on a bluray disc. I don't know if bluray disc support 1080i60. If it does, we have our first sample disc ready to distribute.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2016, 18:29 
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substance wrote:
I don't know if bluray disc support 1080i60. If it does, we have our first sample disc ready to distribute.


1080i30, 720p60, or 1080p24 are the only frame rates Blu-Ray supports.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2016, 19:10 
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Dropbox link to Jurassic Park HiVision LD capture file


It's a 2.4Gb file for the first 23minutes of Jurassic Park Hi-Vision LD. I transcoded it into mp4 with 2ch AC-3 audio. No alterations, no cropping, no scaling. 1080i60.00 video. You will notice black bars on all 4 sides because Hi-Vision LD is 1880x1030i. Both my Macbook pro(Quicktime player) and windows machines(windows media player) combs while deinterlacing, other than that it looks pretty similar to what I see on my TV when run directly from the disc through the Lumagen Radiance 2144. Let me know if the link doesn't work.


Last edited by substance on 05 Feb 2016, 20:11, edited 1 time in total. _________________
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2016, 20:06 
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museld wrote:
substance wrote:
I don't know if bluray disc support 1080i60. If it does, we have our first sample disc ready to distribute.


1080i30, 720p60, or 1080p24 are the only frame rates Blu-Ray supports.


I think its the limitation with the mpeg-2/4 encoding. I can capture 1080i60 uncompressed but once I transcode it to mpeg, it is converted to 1080p30(29.97 really). I think I should capture 1080i59.96 then it should transcode into mpeg without further conversion. The file I have posted is %90 imitation of how Muse encoded films look, we have motion issues (judder) due to 1080i60 to 1080p29.97 conversion. Also the audio is too hot. My intensity shuttle doesn't have any digital inputs, so I used the analog input (not ideal).
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 13 Feb 2016, 06:01 
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substance wrote:
Dropbox link to Jurassic Park HiVision LD capture file


It's a 2.4Gb file for the first 23minutes of Jurassic Park Hi-Vision LD. I transcoded it into mp4 with 2ch AC-3 audio. No alterations, no cropping, no scaling. 1080i60.00 video. You will notice black bars on all 4 sides because Hi-Vision LD is 1880x1030i. Both my Macbook pro(Quicktime player) and windows machines(windows media player) combs while deinterlacing, other than that it looks pretty similar to what I see on my TV when run directly from the disc through the Lumagen Radiance 2144. Let me know if the link doesn't work.


Fantastic video! I know it's obvious but it's basically like HD but in analogue form - it's not artificially perfect like Blu Ray. The quality is excellent and picture is sharp. I urge anyone who's remotely interested to check it out as substance has done a great job!
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2016, 00:56 
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Very excited to see you taking a crack at this! Thank you very much for the sample video. Lovely to watch.

You should be able to encode 1080i60 to interlaced H.264 without issue. I see you used Handbrake, which I've only personally used a handful of times. It's oriented toward progressive encoding, but that's a limitation of this specific software, not MPEG-2/4 in general. In the "Additional Options" box of the Video tab showing "H.264 (x264)", try adding --tff. Keep the frame rate at 30.

1080i60.00 is not a concern for file-based playback, and if you want Blu-ray compatibility you can just remove the pulldown before encoding the captured file, as mentioned before. I believe Handbrake is capable of this, though it would be an auto mode that can fail on certain scenes. I would personally prefer to do it manually, but that may require Windows. I did a manual IVTC on this sample clip, and the pattern is 100% consistent from start of the Universal logo to end of the sample. So it probably only breaks on side changes.

I'm not an expert with regard to H.264 encoding settings; I pretty much pick an x264 preset and go with it. But I do have extensive experience with capture and processing (exception: color correction). Perhaps you'd be open to discussing via email so that we can both respond faster.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2017, 16:10 
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First of all, thanks to substance for the clip! :clap:

I found it recently, and I like it very much! Not BD quality, of course, but better than a DVD, and I think just a little bit short of a 720p HDTV broadcast (apart interlaced vs progressive, of course!).

More, it has a different color grading from any other known released versions and HDTV recordings... it will be great if you can provide also the other sides, so a restoration using the MUSE color grading as reference could be possible.

Thanks again!
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 08 May 2017, 03:11 
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I started building a new desktop PC. It's going to take me a little while to put all components together(and buy them as well). My goal was to be able to capture 1 side (60 minutes) of Muse video in lossless in one take. For this I need 1 to 1.5TB of really fast solid state storage drives. SSDs at this size are still very expensive. So far I have...

Asus Tuf Z270 mark 1 motherboard
Intel i7-7700k CPU
Evga Nvidia 970 GTX 4GB GPU

I plan to get two Samsung 960 Pro m.2 1TB solid state drives which will be in Raid0 for a 2TB total. I need to get some DDR4 ram and perhaps a second 970 GTX for SLI. The capture card will be Blackmagic Intensity 4K PCIe version.

I will do most of the processing in hardware and real time such as

-Geometry (Scale 1035i to 1080i)
-De-interlacing (1080i to 1080p)
-Frame rate conversion (60.00 to 23.97fps)
-Digital video noise reduction (2D/3D Adaptive Gaussian Filtering)

Final product will be captures at 10bit 4:4:4 Raw and converted to H.265 to be burned on a Blu-ray disc. I should have all the components and first Muse titles fully duplicated on a Blu-ray disc by end of summer.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 11 May 2017, 08:19 
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substance, are you open to any assistance from the community to help cover the costs of getting this going?
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 11 May 2017, 12:20 
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whatchitfoool wrote:
substance, are you open to any assistance from the community to help cover the costs of getting this going?


All help is welcome. So far at least financially its been %100 on me.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 11 May 2017, 23:27 
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I never captured the movies (no point IMO). But the scenery discs and NEC fish discs, I'll find a way to upload the MPEG2 files tomorrow. Preferably someone hosts them, or I may put one up a day, and every 24 hours cycle them out.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 12 May 2017, 05:14 
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Here's one of the NEC Fish discs:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6Oax1 ... sp=sharing

Here's Ordinary Europe:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6Oax1 ... sp=sharing

I'm leaving these up for 48 hours only. After, they will be deleted. If you download, please share and make available to others.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 12 May 2017, 06:11 
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museld wrote:
Here's one of the NEC Fish discs:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6Oax1 ... sp=sharing

Here's Ordinary Europe:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6Oax1 ... sp=sharing

I'm leaving these up for 48 hours only. After, they will be deleted. If you download, please share and make available to others.

Awesome! Thanks
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 12 May 2017, 07:08 
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Never had a Fish Disc. Thanks for sharing!
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 14 May 2017, 00:25 
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substance wrote:
All help is welcome. So far at least financially its been %100 on me.


paypal?
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 14 May 2017, 00:33 
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Well I placed the final order on the last bit of parts (2x 1Tb Samsung 969 Pro m.2 ssd) I need on my supercomputer. My capture rig will be ready in a couple of weeks once I receive all the parts. I still need help in the software side.

Also someone pointed out to me the Muse decoders we have don't have the optimal electronics for the 2017 standards. I plan to design a new power section and get rid of all the switch mode crap there. I also hope to modify the output for hd-sdi but I am not too optimistic on this one. I would rather do these captures once and put this project behind me therefore I am going to wait till I have the definitive configuration(which I am almost there)
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 14 May 2017, 23:47 
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Hey, you have an impressive video chain Substance, but what about the audio side?

I know i'm new to the forums, but I've been trying to take a stab at these captures for a while, just regular LD's though... and a pre-amp before the audio signal hits the capture device is almost necessary for older analog or stereo in general rips. I personally use the Sennheiser HDVD800 to handle my DAC/amp needs for the stereo LD's (and listening in general, the HD800's really are magic!)
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 17 May 2017, 16:18 
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ruggedalbatross wrote:
Hey, you have an impressive video chain Substance, but what about the audio side?

I know i'm new to the forums, but I've been trying to take a stab at these captures for a while, just regular LD's though... and a pre-amp before the audio signal hits the capture device is almost necessary for older analog or stereo in general rips. I personally use the Sennheiser HDVD800 to handle my DAC/amp needs for the stereo LD's (and listening in general, the HD800's really are magic!)


Audio as in for playback or capture?

My audio is gear built around McIntosh Pre-Pro and Power amps. All speakers are Martin Logan electrostatics, currently at 7.2 but the plan is 7.4.4 in the near future.

As for my capture gear, video is the primary concern. Lumagen Radiance 2144 is going to transcode the analog/digital audio into the HDMI stream which will be fed into the capture card.
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 Post subject: Re: MUSE/HI-VISION to BD/HD-DVD/AVC-DVD Project
PostPosted: 19 May 2017, 17:06 
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Bram Stoker's Dracula (1992) [HVMC-14590]
Bugsy (1991) [HVMC-13645]
Close Encounters of the Third Kind: Special Edition (1980) [HVMC-10003]
In the Line of Fire (1993) [HVMC-19668]
Lawrence of Arabia (1962) [HVMC-12058]
League of Their Own, A (1992) [HVMC-14589]
Legends of the Fall (1994) [HVMC-21588]
Silence of the Lambs, The (1991) [HVMC-12819]
Sleepless in Seattle (1993) [HVMC-19799]

Panasonic:

Back to the Future (1985) [PA-HD80196]
Back to the Future Part II (1989) [PA-HD80914]
Back to the Future Part III (1990) [PA-HD80976]
E.T. (1982) [PA-HD77012]
Jurassic Park (1993) [PA-HD82061]

Pioneer:

Atlantis (1991) [PILH-1003]
Basic Instinct (1992) (Uncut) [PILH-1002]
Chaplin (1992) [PILH-1005]
Cliffhanger (1993) [PILH-1007]
Dances with Wolves (1990) (Uncut) [PILH-7001]
Stargate (1994) [PILH-1008]
Terminator 2: Judgment Day (1991) [PILH-1001]
Top Gun (1986) [PA-HD71692]
Universal Soldier (1992) [PILH-1004]
Wolf (1994) [HVMC-18647]

Demo

Alaska: Last Frontier (1994) [00MW-0008]
Ferrari of the Art [COLE-50004]
Guyana - The Lost World [00MW-0016]
Katie & Marielle Labeque: The Loves of Emma Bardac [SRLM 1067]
Maeda - Hills of the Seasons (1990) [00MW-0005]
Musee du Louvre 2 [ICHL-0002]
Pictures at an Exhibition, Solti CSO [SRLM 1068]
Pioneer: Hi-Vision LD Demonstration Disc (1993) [HE-100]
Song of Africa (1997) [00MW-0014]
Sony: The Test Disc (1995) [00MW-0009]


Custom Capture PC nearly finished, I can soon start testing various equipment and titles. I plan to capture one of the above titles I have in hand with the unmodified stock equipment. I will later re-capture the same title with the modified equipment.

First capture will be Pioneer HLD-X9 -> Sony MSC-4000 -> Capture PC via component.

If Julien helps me here, we can have a poll for the first title for this project.
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