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 Post subject: MUSE-NTSC Converters
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2015, 14:40 
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Today I received my Toshiba TT-DC10, which I got for one yen (plus commission & shipping...). You may wonder why I should be excited about this, but there are two reasons.
First, it is absolutely brand new, complete down to the two AA batteries for the remote control.
Second, it is a pretty remarkable model. Not only does it have "Full" (16:9), "Zoom" (4:3 crop), & "Wide" (16:9 letterbox into 4:3) modes, but it appears to have both a function to move the 4:3 frame back & forth in the 16:9 frame, & a component video output.

I have two MUSE decoders with the downcoversion function, the Panasonic TU-AHD100N & the Victor HV-VMD1, but the latter is broken. Using this converter, I can check out the function of my Hi-Vision LD player on a small portable video monitor.

Photos to follow.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2015, 18:26 
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Congratulations - you don't get a much better price than that. I wonder if the seller ended up thinking if it had been worth the effort to even post it for a return off just 1 yen!!

I think I saw this while hunting for the decoder I ended up with a bit later. It had the original box and packaging along with what looked like all the original cables. I wondered why the photo just showed the unit still in the plastic wrap so that it wasn't even visible. The ad didn't seem to mention it was unopened but that makes a little more sense now - perhaps they didn't want to break the seal (even for the sake of seeing the unit which might have helped the sale price - but to your benefit it seems!)

I assume these M-N converter type units only output the downconverted to NTSC signal and no HD signal?
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2015, 21:35 
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audioboyz1973 wrote:
I assume these M-N converter type units only output the downconverted to NTSC signal and no HD signal?

Yes, in fact, inside the front cover of the manual is a sternly-worded reminder that, although the converter allows you to display the Hi-Vision program on your standard TV, what you get will not be Hi-Vision. On the other hand, as I mentioned, some MUSE decoders also include a downconversion output, maybe to allow you to record programs on your VCR.

I figured that, if it had been up for some weeks at a starting bid of Y1 & nobody had snapped it up, the seller might get frustrated & throw it in the trash. Couldn't let that happen!
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 04 Oct 2015, 06:15 
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10 Yen is a great price. Congratulations !
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2015, 04:11 
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I don't normally do the "unboxing" thing, but in this case it seemed reasonable to make an exception.
First, the box. Still hanging from one side is the envelope with the special warranty form.
Image
Next, the decoder, all wrapped up in plastic bag & foam sheeting, with styrofoam bumpers, and the accessories, all in their bags. There are two RCA cables with yellow plugs bearing a moulded-in "VIDEO", a pair of RCA cables with red & white plugs bearing a moulded-in "L" & "R", an S-Video cable with arrows moulded into the plugs to help in correctly orienting them, & a cable with 8-pin mini-DIN plugs for the component video output. I wonder if the bright red AA cells are still good after 20 years?
Image
The decoder from the front. For those concerned about radio-frequency interference, Toshiba included a noise filter in the power plug.
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The same, with the door open to show the front-panel controls.
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The rear panel, showing the mix of gold & plain RCA connector shells. The usual dual SPDIF outputs are present, in this case (no surprise) TOSlink. There are two switches : one, for Output 1, switches between 4-channel & 2-channel downmix audio output, when A-Mode 3-1 audio is being decoded. The second, for the "external input", has three positions : in position A, the audio embedded in the MUSE signal is decoded ; the use of positions B & C is a little unclear, & I will have to come back to that question.
Image

It works! Here we see the unit in operation, connected via S-Video to a high-resolution CCTV monitor ; the MUSE source is my HIL-C2EX, connected to the "external" input, playing back chapter 6 of The Test Disk. This is the "Full" or 16:9 mode.
Image
This is the "Wide" or letterboxed (16:9 into 4:3) mode. The background bars are medium-gray (although they appear bluish in this picture), a nice protection against "burn-in".
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This is the "Zoom" or 4:3 crop mode, first centered, then shifted all the way right and left.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2015, 04:16 
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Its nice. What happened to your msc-3000?
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2015, 04:32 
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It's sitting at my left hand as I type this. It doesn't appear in the above photos because the point is to display what the TT-DC10 does.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2015, 04:41 
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Can you see any performance differences between the sony and toshiba(and panasonic) in muse?
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2015, 04:45 
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This Toshiba is only a downconverter, not a full decoder, so a proper comparison would not be possible. I have not sat down & done comparison tests of my Sony MST-2000, Sony MSC-3000, Victor HV-VMD1 (currently non-working), & Panasonic TU-AHD100N against each other.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2015, 23:34 
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Well, blow me down. Referring to the manual, it appears the component output is in fact progressive-scan.
Now, you might ask "what kind of TV can handle 525p but not 1125i", & I'd have to admit I don't know, but the manual says to connect this to a Toshiba 34ED1, a model I've been able to find out nothing about.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 09 Oct 2015, 22:51 
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Pinout of the Component Video Connector (8-Pin Mini-DIN)
  1. Sync
  2. 0 V
  3. 0 V
  4. 0 V
  5. 0 V
  6. Non-composite Y
  7. Non-composite Pb
  8. Non-composite Pr

Yes, this is at double scanrate. And yes, "non-composite" means separate sync : the Y signal never goes below blanking level. So adapting this to any normal composite video input is going to require more than just splicing wires.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2016, 20:28 
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Maybe I'm confused, but can the 4 channel audio input go out on digital? My last receiver upgrade dropped the 7.1 analog inputs leaving me only with stereo or digital inputs.
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 Post subject: Re: M-N Converters
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2016, 20:55 
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rchiffelle wrote:
Maybe I'm confused, but can the 4 channel audio input go out on digital? My last receiver upgrade dropped the 7.1 analog inputs leaving me only with stereo or digital inputs.

In general, no. Some members here have looked into running the 4-channel analog outs to a DTS encoder or something like that. In general, however, where a 4-channel digital output is available from a MUSE decoder, it's in the form of two SPDIF outputs side-by-side, each carrying 2 channels. That's not really much use to anybody. In principle you ought to be able to combine those & put them on HDMI, but I don't even know what kind of equipment you'd need. (Likewise, I've thought about taking the "Bitstream" output present on most decoders/converters & converting into PCM over HDMI.)
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