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 Post subject: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2018, 23:30 
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Interesting marketing figures are now in & hard times for some.
The bit below was from just before the last Christmas sales burst that did not help in the end an already problematic market.

Media & Entertainment #MarketMoves
DEC 21, 2017
Forbes
Why Aren't Star Wars Toys Selling As Well This Year?
It's not necessarily the allegedly divisive nature of The Last Jedi's plot (which hasn't kept it from making over half a billion dollars worldwide already), but something has caused retail orders to decrease by about 47 per cent from last year. The Hollywood Reporter suggests Toys R Us' filing for bankruptcy may be a factor, though you'd think they'd still invest heavily in Star Wars if it were a surefire sales generator. They also suggest "retailers are trying to gain a sense of 'what the steady state' of Star Wars product is," though looking at the numbers isn't hard: Star Wars toys were the top brand of 2016 with nearly $760 million in sales, and they were also the #1 property in 2015, with similar numbers. This year? Bested by Nerf and Pokemon.
But the reasons The Last Jedi's toys aren't selling quite as well (with some notable exceptions -- Fandango FanShop reports that their #1 bestseller is a plush Porg) might be a lot more straightforward. Let's look at the most obvious factors:
First, there's Rogue One, last year's Star Wars movie, which launched a large range of products...and many of them are still hanging around. Retail buyers aren't necessarily toy collectors or fans who distinguish between individual movies, so if they see Star Wars toys from last year still hanging around on shelves, they won't necessarily be excited to order a lot more.
Granted, for those of us who can distinguish between movies, the Rogue One line had some unique issues: it was a darker Star Wars film that killed off all its heroes and might not have been as parentally approved as prior installments, the toys tried to incorporate Nerf elements in awkward ways, the incredibly cool but too-expensive app-controlled AT-ACT walker was clearanced immediately after Christmas, and the collector-skewing Black Series figures had issues with materials that made the actor likenesses softer and less on-point than usual. The AT-ACT, which originally retailed for $300, can now be found at Ross stores for $89.99. It's well worth it at that price, but the closeout hardly encourages Hasbro to make toys of the Gorilla Walkers from the new movie, even if they could re-use the same electronics.
Hasbro's quality control has gotten better for The Last Jedi toys, though they're saddled with an interactive sound element called Force Link that's difficult to control. I was sent a sample, and could never make it work consistently, though it scares my wife by turning on and off at odd times. That said, the quality of the toys is not the issue. They're well-sculpted and sturdy, and look like the actors.
But the movie doesn't give them much to work with. While The Empire Strikes Back persuaded kids to re-buy all their favorite characters in snow gear and alternate Cloud City costumes, The Last Jedi mostly keeps its core group in the same or similar duds. The most notable exception, Rey, is one of the few figures that's hard to find. Likewise, there are few new characters to get kids really excited. Benicio Del Toro and Laura Dern's new additions are fairly subdued: only Rose and the Praetorian Guard offer visually novel and narratively dynamic additions. (Also arguably Snoke, but we'll get to him.) When it comes to vehicles, the best new reveals are too massive to sell as figure-compatible toys: the Dreadnought, Snoke's Star Destroyer, the Resistance bombers, and the Gorilla Walker will all get their LEGO due, but for action figures? Not so feasible. When it comes to vehicles that are feasible, Kylo Ren's TIE Silencer is indeed cool, but the main new good-guy fighter, the Ski Speeder, is specifically called out in the movie as junk, and in the story -- SPOILER alert -- all of them crash or blow up. That's not necessarily appealing to a kid.
The final problem isn't a new one for Disney and Hasbro, but in a movie with fewer new possible toys, it hurts the line more this year: spoiler sensitivity. It seems quaint to think that when Return of the Jedi came out, toys of almost every character were available right away, with the Ewoks strategically blacked out on card backs to keep them a surprise. Nowadays, spoiler-culture is such that Disney won't even let the Hasbro team see everything, or potentially reveal any plot point: for The Force Awakens, this meant a strategy of misdirecting consumers into believing Finn would be the next Jedi hero rather than Rey, and not showing the toy people Supreme Leader Snoke or Luke Skywalker's new look.
Knowing Snoke would be revealed this movie, Hasbro bet large on the First Order's leader. The big-ticket item in the 3-3/4 inch figure line is a BB-8 droid that opens up to transform into the interior of Snoke's Star Destroyer (with Snoke figure included); the equivalent for the 6-inch collector's line was a Gamestop-exclusive figure of Snoke on his throne. And then, not to spoil the movie, but...he's not as much of a factor as was perhaps expected, and his function in the plot isn't necessarily one that makes fans want to go out and spend extra money on him. Meanwhile, had Hasbro known Adam Driver would get a shirtless scene, that's one Kylo Ren variant that might have sold quite well out the gate. And another character who makes a surprise appearance may beget some special toys later down the road.
Hasbro did not respond to a request for comment as of publication time; their PR agency is currently on holiday break. But they're probably not doing too badly with the #2 and #3 toys of the year, and Star Wars may get a market injection sooner than usual: as of now, toys based on the Han Solo prequel movie are set to hit stores on April 20th.


The above was compiled a little before the final retail Christmas rush & now the post Christmas figures are in & not good news - perhaps not expected by some & predicted by others but sales drops of over 50% on some lines is quite staggering. The sales figures are based on Hasbro sales but the Star wars lines by most if not all the "side suppliers" have been hit very hard indeed as they do not have the huge backing of a Hasbro or similar to buffer the hit, a few may struggle for a while & some may simply not survive. Even with the very heavy discounting (below cost in many cases) the goods are not shifting, there are many "bargains" to be had. Even the so called "serious collectors" market is in a bit of a state of flux just now with some items dropping in (again so called) value, it looks like the Star Wars cash cow has taken a hit that might be hard to pull back. Given the total saturation of the Star Wars brand & the number of new films out & announced has perhaps not helped though the way Disney have handled some things have been a bit controlling but not unexpected.
It really has hit some retailers/suppliers/manufacturers very hard with quite a few now sitting on stock/inventory than is not shifting even with very severe price cuts both retail & wholesale - the "high quality" lightsabers market has been hit very hard & there are some bargains to be had at a fraction of the retail SSP if you are looking for them.
Is all this just a blip or a sign of the times - has the Star Wars marketing cash cow hit a bit of a wall? Has the world finally had enough of the hype around Star Wars? Does anyone really care now?
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2018, 23:48 
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WOW that's a lot to read.
I'll get back to that later and read the entire thing.

I heard on the radio that Disney made over what they paid for the franchise when the last movie opened.
So toys and other stuff may be hurting but the films are the real juggernaut in my opinion.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2018, 01:47 
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I think a lot has to do with it being the tech age. When I was 8 and 9 I played with the action figures and Legos, now kids that age are getting iphones and ipads, they don't really care about toys anymore.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2018, 15:19 
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sjoerg wrote:
I think a lot has to do with it being the tech age. When I was 8 and 9 I played with the action figures and Legos, now kids that age are getting iphones and ipads, they don't really care about toys anymore.


My thoughts exactly. Also if they are alienating certain adult fans who traditionally collected toys, then maybe those fans stopped buying.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2018, 18:26 
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somewhere between 1987/1989 my mom bought me a large collection of SW toys spanning all three original film product lines,
all for $50 in the local PORTLAND classifieds.

like most young SW fans, BOBA FETT was one of my favorites, and, around 1989/1990, when my mom took me to a STAR TREK convention,
a dealer in the dealers' room had a MOC ROTJ BOBA FETT for like $15.00.

mom bought it for me, but insisted on keeping it out of my hands, insisting it was for my future.
i kept on her about it for like a year, and, sympathetic during a strait of hard times, she broke down and gave it to me.

needless to say, it did not remain MOC much longer.

that f***ing thing is now ostensibly worth about a grand now; https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sealed-Vintage ... SwB4BaJaSQ
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2018, 19:44 
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tasuke wrote:
somewhere between 1987/1989 my mom bought me a large collection of SW toys spanning all three original film product lines,
all for $50 in the local PORTLAND classifieds.

like most young SW fans, BOBA FETT was one of my favorites, and, around 1989/1990, when my mom took me to a STAR TREK convention,
a dealer in the dealers' room had a MOC ROTJ BOBA FETT for like $15.00.

mom bought it for me, but insisted on keeping it out of my hands, insisting it was for my future.
i kept on her about it for like a year, and, sympathetic during a strait of hard times, she broke down and gave it to me.

needless to say, it did not remain MOC much longer.

that f***ing thing is now ostensibly worth about a grand now; https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sealed-Vintage ... SwB4BaJaSQ

Don't forget its only worth a grand due to people like you who opened them.

If everybody kept them sealed it would be worthless.
Everybody who owns one sealed should be thanking you for driving up the market. :thumbup:
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 00:04 
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When I was a kid Star Wars would actually take a break. After Jedi the toy sales pretty much stopped for like, I don’t know, 6-8 years until the 90s line started up.

Star Wars is now CONSTANTLY PRESENT in EVERY SECTION OF EVERY DEPARTMENT STORE during every season year after year. Maybe this planet’s capacity for Star Wars love isn’t as infinate as the housing market (which, it also turns out, not infinite).

Maybe people have enough Han Solos. Maybe Hasbro sucks at keeping their toys relevant. I don’t do Star Wars but as a fan of Transformers I can attest that they are absolutely clueless at doing that series any good. Even the so-called “Masterpiece” line has fallen so many notches they seem like regular releases now, not even as good as the 30 year old toys they are based on. Everyone from Bandai to Fischer Price makes better Robots now.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 01:34 
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signofzeta wrote:
When I was a kid Star Wars would actually take a break. After Jedi the toy sales pretty much stopped for like, I don’t know, 6-8 years until the 90s line started up.

Maybe people have enough Han Solos.


When I was drinkin Colt .45s with Lando I told him I was sure Power of the Force started late '80s but he googled it and told me '95..go figure..
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 10:06 
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I may be wrong, however I feel that the FORCE is not strong with team disney ......

Disney seems to be strong with the dark side of greed, social justice, and tragically flawed story writing.
A Leviathan that gobbles up most anything that the public has deemed "good" and of "quality" only to then regurgitate its quarry into something drastically maligned ......

Has anyone asked George Lucas what his thoughts are about the continuity of his modern day mythos ? Privately for certain he is outspoken !
Very curious if he is on record stating an opinion or two ?
Not bloody well likely though. A key part of the transaction with disney may have been an agreement to keep "mum" about any conflicting feelings about that subject publicly .....

Will quote a very apropos phrase that I use when feeling strong disdain for anything odious ...... TO THE CAT LITTER ! :mrgreen:

Thank goodness for the LaserDisc format. One can still view the Star Wars Saga in the privacy of ones own home, untainted by :twisted: .......

Cheers to the membership !

Apologies for the moderately off topic comment..........
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 11:05 
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Star Wars is mainstream crapola. It always has been. It’s the most spiritually hollow merch grab in history. It may as well be owned by Disney. I can’t think of anyone better.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 12:06 
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signofzeta wrote:
Star Wars is mainstream crapola. It always has been. It’s the most spiritually hollow merch grab in history. It may as well be owned by Disney. I can’t think of anyone better.



Will not argue that point signofzeta......
Left a good impression on an 11 year old though.
By the time Return of the Jedi came out I personally was "over it" ......

Still a did a good job reviving myths of old from antiquity in my experience. In our modern day tendency to "forget" history and the dusty myths wasting on the shelves of old bookstores unnoticed, Star Wars ignited a spark of hope that good could win over evil and that Father and Son could find common ground after all was said and done. Looking back and reflecting on my experience this was true.

Yes, marketing gets old, yes, the Ewok adventures and Battle for Endor were corny as he**. I get it.

Modern man needs archetypal symbolism long forgotten more then ever before. Hollywood does not even come close to replacing the purpose of myth.
Even as the Greeks of yore needed their archetypal myths to guide them through generation after generation of life, modern man yearns for help probing the depths of the psyche and unconscious parts of our vast inner selves......
When we forget what we are, where we came from, and what we are capable of..... We are doomed to repeat the past horrors that we have already lived through.
Most notably the horrors of the last century when people forgot the value of the individual vs. society as a whole.

That's what Star Wars did for this past 11 y/o kid. It sparked my imagination and encouraged me to get after more of the same through reading and embracing those points just mentioned.

So yeah, commercialism can make crapola out of ANYTHING it gets its tentacles on...... Try not to forget the "reason for it all" is what I recommend.

A LONG TIME AGO,
IN A GALAXY FAR, FAR AWAY .....
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 12:28 
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firehorse_44 wrote:

Has anyone asked George Lucas what his thoughts are about the continuity of his modern day mythos ?


I have my own continuity. It started in 1977 and finished in 1985.

Lucas had his chance to do sequels and he screwed them up just as badly as the Disney ones.

I don't care what his thoughts on the Disney movies are, Star Wars OT as we know it was largely not even his ideas, he's an overrated hack. Think the same of Shoji Kawamori about Macross.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 15:43 
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What about Buichi Tereasawa and something like Space Cobra.
Anybody feel its like a Philip K Dick story that was then turned into a film after Space Cobra???????
And I'm sure Dick stole the premise from someone else.

Its really about what holds up and what doesn't.
For me it was Star Wars, when I made my wife watch it for the first time and she couldn't understand what all the grunting from the aliens were all
about it did it in for me.

I can't truly watch it now without thinking how ridiculous it really is, and I'm only talking about the first film, they go down from there.
But I do own them and will keep them in the collection.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 17:57 
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It’s not that I think Star Wars, the movies, the ones I’ve seen, are bad. Far from it. At least two are great! The issue is that asside from FX they don’t do anything original well at all. Everything good about Star Wars exists in hundereds of other things. It’s not like Gundam or Macross or Next Gen or most of what Tezuka did, or THX1138 or Solaris or Slaughterhouse Five or A Boy and His Dog or Bladerunner or even Alien. It’s just a western in space. It doesn’t deserve the devotion it has, that’s why I’m constantly saying I’m done with SW or SW sucks. Star Wars...as a phenomenon has become very sucky.

It’s like Trump. People liked him as a TV star...but lose their enthusiasm when he’s THE ONLY star on TV. You can take a mediocre thing too far...way to far.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 18:18 
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forper wrote:
When I was drinkin Colt .45s with Lando I told him I was sure Power of the Force started late '80s but he googled it and told me '95..go figure..


there were two "POWER OF THE FORCE" umbrella lines, the original 1985 unified figure line, consisting of reissues of the first three films' worth of figures,
then came the brand new PotF series in 1995, consisting of all-new, now quite dubious-looking figure sculpts;

Image

Image



forper wrote:
he's an overrated hack. Think the same of Shoji Kawamori about Macross.


sorry, it takes a talent beyond being a mere hack to dream up Mecha design of this caliber;

Image

Image

Image

Image
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 21:20 
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I refuse to purchase anything Force awakens & last Jedi related. And that is because those movies are an abomination.
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2018, 22:33 
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Well, a man’s got to stand for something, right?
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2018, 03:49 
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tasuke wrote:
forper wrote:
When I was drinkin Colt .45s with Lando I told him I was sure Power of the Force started late '80s but he googled it and told me '95..go figure..


there were two "POWER OF THE FORCE" umbrella lines, the original 1985 unified figure line, consisting of reissues of the first three films' worth of figures,
then came the brand new PotF series in 1995, consisting of all-new, now quite dubious-looking figure sculpts;



Well, there ya go! My memory didn't desert me, I was just reading more misleading internet info that only really scratches the surface. Thanks for the real knowledge. Asking a human for specific info is still faster than digging through all the crap on the internet 9 times out of 10.

Yeah those ones with the coins were definately '80s and Zeta is still right that there was a long break. I remember the coin Power of the Force figures still being available in Australia until about 1988 though. But yeah, after that there was a long hiatus.

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forper wrote:
he's an overrated hack. Think the same of Shoji Kawamori about Macross.


sorry, it takes a talent beyond being a mere hack to dream up Mecha design of this caliber;


Oh as a mechanical designer he is one of the gods just for the transformation mechanism. Problem is he was never a good writer, director or producer. Somehow he has controlled the entire Macross franchise since 1995 and it has sucked since 1995.

My Macross Canon starts in 1982 and ends with 1992's Big West (Kawamori absent) Macross II.

Macross II wasn't great but it was a far more worthy sequel with waaaay cooler mecha than Macross 7 and everything after.

Macross 7 was just ridiculous comedy and unworthy, Macross plus was an off the shelf aviation animation with the Macross name stuck on, Macross Frontier suffered the same pointless retread phenomenon as Disney Star Wars. Macross 0 was okay actually. The latest Macross? Who cares?
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2018, 03:54 
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signofzeta wrote:
It’s just a western in space. It doesn’t deserve the devotion it has,


I thought it was The Hidden Fortress in space? At least it has good influences. And the magic of it was the character interaction, the design, music and effects all came together so well. It was a phenomenon for a reason. It has mainstream appeal and geek respect. It even has respect from fashion and design people. It was ruined by CGI and Lucas having too much control long before Disney.

Says it all:

Image
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 Post subject: Re: Has the STAR WARS marketing juggernaut stalled???
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2018, 04:49 
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tasuke wrote:

Attachment:
POWER OF THE FORCE 1985 STORMTROOPER1.png
POWER OF THE FORCE 1985 STORMTROOPER1.png [ 1.02 MiB | Viewed 4232 times ]


Looks like Skywalker has been working out down at the tosche station gym on those power converters Look at the size of arms. Look at the size of his chest. If he pumps those power converters anymore his biceps will pop. :lol:
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