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 Post subject: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 15:27 
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From worst to best . Corrections accepted

Vcd
Video 2000
Beta
VHS
S-VHS
Ed-Beta
Laserdisc
W-VHS
DVD
Laserdisc HiVision
HD DVD
Bluray
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 15:37 
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You left off CED, which would be tied with VCD for last, I’d say.

I’m not sure how you figure BR is better than HD-DVD. They are essentially the same but HD-DVD had much less annoying menues in many cases.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 16:18 
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Betamax is better than VHS by a little bit.

And you forgot D-VHS
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 16:20 
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Yes looks good except HD-DVD and BD are identical. Also D-Theater can match an average BD as well.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 17:44 
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I also thought beta was supposed to be above VHS, I wouldn't know but, would a D-theater tape surpass a Muse LD in quality?
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 19:21 
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sjoerg wrote:
I also thought beta was supposed to be above VHS, I wouldn't know but, would a D-theater tape surpass a Muse LD in quality?


Yes by a margin. Even some Sqz LDs surpass Hi-vision LDs. I would say Hi-vision LDs, especially film discs sits pretty close to DVD. Static scenes can come close to HD on cable TV but during motion it is pretty comparable to DVD(a well mastered DVD would have less issues). Most D-theater discs are very comparable to BD. Most people couldn’t tell the difference.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 20:26 
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OK....updates;

CED
Vcd
Video 2000
Beta --------- Vhs
S-Vhs
Ed-Beta
Laserdisc
W-Vhs
Laserdisc HiVision
DVD
D-Vhs
Bluray ------- HD DVD




Any other change?
Vhs much better HiFi stereo than
Beta do you agree? PQ for Beta a bit

Do you realize at this point digital video (SD & HD)
blows away every analog device
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:10 
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If not above DVD as you originally had it Hi-Vision LD should at least be on par with DVD; though I still definitely think above.

Any ranking like this suffers the debates over specific examples that were tankers vs the best showings of the format. Like substance alluded to the poorer mastered HVLD releases can be pretty ordinary (thinking Basic Instinct as an example right now). On that example some scenes like the opening do seem to look better on the Sqz version, but as soon as you have a well lit scene the higher definition of the HVLD is clear (most obvious in long shots of the City which look like a blurred mess on the Sqz by comparison).

If I take the best issues the format could offer and put them on the projector there's no doubt while technically inferior I could convince most people it was BD, they really can look exceptionally good. Full disclosure that's a handful and they'd all be scenery discs - shot on HD video equipment of the era and well mastered. Unfortunately film transfers weren't quite up to it in that era.


Last edited by audioboyz1973 on 10 Mar 2018, 21:15, edited 1 time in total. _________________
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:10 
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That's a cool list, ertoili.

I think my Basic Instinct HiVision Laserdisc looks worse than some of my better DVDs. Yes, it is anamorphic but the amount of compression artifacts is amazing. My Okinawa Underwarte HiVision Laserdisc however looks considerably better than the DVD ( I have the same title on DVD with extras unavailable on the HiVision disc itself ). It looks like real HiDef Video.

In fact, Basic Instinct looked so bad that I thought my player or MUSE decoder was broken. It is that bad.

Video CD is the worst without any doubt. It is considerably worse than VHS in my opinion. There are some well mastered VCDs that look OK but it is a terrible format overall.

The rest of the list looks good.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:17 
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Okinawa was definitely one of the "best of" I had in mind!
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:24 
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audioboyz1973 wrote:
Okinawa was definitely one of the "best of" I had in mind!


I have the following MUSE titles:

Basic Instinct -> Looks terrible, worse than DVD.

Hi-Vision Art Library: Sekiguchi -> Very rare title, looks really good, better than DVD

Suzuka Grand Prix F1 1991-92 -> Looks excellent in my view, better than DVD

Okinawa Underwater -> It appears to have been one of the first MUSE releases but it is also one of the best-looking ones

Paris -> Kind of hard to say, I think it looks an anamorphic DVD, I guess, it is not really super sharp but not too bad, either

Sinzo Maeda: Hill of the Seasons -> I like this title but once again that doesn't really look very HD-ish to me, not bad, either though

Stargate -> Looks better than Basic Instinct, but far away from a Blu Ray retail disc
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:28 
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Don't forget 4K UHD Blu Ray.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:41 
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...........updates;

Vcd (shame on you)
CED
Video 2000
Beta --------- Vhs
S-Vhs
Ed-Beta
Laserdisc
W-Vhs
DVD
Laserdisc HiVision
D-Vhs
Bluray ------- HD DVD
Bluray HDR
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:45 
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confederate wrote:

I have the following MUSE titles:

Basic Instinct -> Looks terrible, worse than DVD.

Hi-Vision Art Library: Sekiguchi -> Very rare title, looks really good, better than DVD

Suzuka Grand Prix F1 1991-92 -> Looks excellent in my view, better than DVD

Okinawa Underwater -> It appears to have been one of the first MUSE releases but it is also one of the best-looking ones

Paris -> Kind of hard to say, I think it looks an anamorphic DVD, I guess, it is not really super sharp but not too bad, either

Sinzo Maeda: Hill of the Seasons -> I like this title but once again that doesn't really look very HD-ish to me, not bad, either though

Stargate -> Looks better than Basic Instinct, but far away from a Blu Ray retail disc

I don't have Paris but do have the rest and overall agree with your assessments.

Hills of the Seasons surprises me though. I rank this as one of the absolute best, right up there with Okinawa, some of the fine detail in this is amazing with an almost total lack of compression artefacts, not to mention the fantastic photography. Perhaps the difference is in the decoder? For example I was originally using the Sony but managed to obtain the Pioneer. At the time Universal Soldier was a newly acquired title, and it looked really ordinary and quite soft on the Sony. Then on the Pioneer it suddenly changed, looking quite grainy or noisy but simultaneously much clearer and sharper. Nothing looked worse on the Pioneer but several titles were noticeably better.

"Looks better than Basic Instinct, but far away from a Blu Ray retail disc" I think this applies to most of the films; transfer technology has improved vastly since then, and most films are shot digital now anyway. Still Basic Instinct is definitely a low point and there are quite a few films I really do enjoy watching on HVLD.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 21:48 
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audioboyz1973 wrote:
I don't have Paris but do have the rest and overall agree with your assessments.

Hills of the Seasons surprises me though. I rank this as one of the absolute best, right up there with Okinawa, some of the fine detail in this is amazing with an almost total lack of compression artefacts, not to mention the fantastic photography. Perhaps the difference is in the decoder? For example I was originally using the Sony but managed to obtain the Pioneer. At the time Universal Soldier was a newly acquired title, and it looked really ordinary and quite soft on the Sony. Then on the Pioneer it suddenly changed, looking quite grainy or noisy but simultaneously much clearer and sharper. Nothing looked worse on the Pioneer but several titles were noticeably better.

"Looks better than Basic Instinct, but far away from a Blu Ray retail disc" I think this applies to most of the films; transfer technology has improved vastly since then, and most films are shot digital now anyway. Still Basic Instinct is definitely a low point and there are quite a few films I really do enjoy watching on HVLD.


That's interesting. I think I should have a look at that Hills of the Seasons disc again. I watched it like once. I have the Sony decoder btw.

But that Suzuzka F1 disc looks really amazing in my opinion. It is also one of the longer discs.

I have also seen a rip of that Ferrari of the Art disc. It looks excellent ! I think I found it on some tracker years ago lol:D It is an excellent rip.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 22:27 
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The Suzuka is very good, though I have been led to believe the Ferrrari of the Art is even better (haven't seen the rip), unfortunately that one seems to be more rare, and I'm not much of a fan of motor-sports anyway!!!

Hills might in some ways be considered 'boring' by some but Shinzo Maeda was a very gifted Japanese photographic artist and from the rough translation I've done from the disc this was his first HD video work. Shot over a full year in rural Japan it really is visually wonderful. That it was shot in the late 80's but with true HD quality just adds to its appeal. https://www.google.com.au/search?client=firefox-b&dcr=0&ei=_UqkWtySEMeW8wWBu6NA&q=Shinzo+Maeda%3A&oq=Shinzo+Maeda%3A&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39k1j0l5j0i22i30k1l4.59882.60327.0.62183.2.2.0.0.0.0.261.512.2-2.2.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.2.511....0.rlQIndm7WTw
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2018, 22:43 
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Anyway, back to the thread topic; where would VHD fit? Above CED I gather but no idea compared to those video formats above it?
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 11 Mar 2018, 01:08 
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Any info please about VHD video format ??
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 11 Mar 2018, 01:39 
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signofzeta wrote:
I’m not sure how you figure BR is better than HD-DVD. They are essentially the same but HD-DVD had much less annoying menues in many cases.

I was gonna say that blu-ray supports a better video codec but according to wikipedia they both use the same ones - but blu-ray does have higher storage capacity and max bitrate than HD-DVD.
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 Post subject: Re: Picture quality scale by format
PostPosted: 11 Mar 2018, 01:54 
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I feel the VHD format is around with VHS in terms of picture quality. It isn't terrible, but not great either.
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