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 Post subject: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...phew
PostPosted: 17 Oct 2017, 17:38 
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Hi Everyone,

First post, just joined :D
I have a Pioneer 925 LD Player, had since new, a collection of LDs and an older amp which had an AC-3 Demodulator built in the Yammy DSP-A2.
Long story short, I have a load of films when I used to enjoy the 925 and the Yammy, but have had the Onkyo 5010 for about 4 years now and decided to hook them all up, to show my son who is 11, he was amazed by the 'really big CDs'
I just want to know if I am decoding the AC-3 correctly, it all sounds good, but hopefully you experts can fill in a few blanks.

I thought of using the Yammy in the loop as I previously bought off fleabay an AC-3 demodulator the APD-1 and it would not work so sent it back. The Yammy always worked with the 925 when I had them both before the Onk and I thought this might work.

So, the 925 is hooked up via RF AC-3 to the Yammy AC-3 input, I have also used an S-Video cable from the 925 into the Yammy and output the picture from Monitor Out to the Onkyo which the upscales, the picture looks great.

The sound is coming into the Yammy and there is a RED signal in the Optical Output which I then take to the Onkyo, but no sound. I do get sound when I take an additional Optical from the back of the 925 into the Onkyo though, but I don't know if this is producing the best sound.

If I am not mistaken, the AC-3 is being decoded in the Yammy so why is that not being pulled into the Onkyo, the signal is there?

The sound from the additional Optical is good, but then the Onk can make anything sound great. I just want to know if I am getting the AC-3 signal correctly to the Onkyo, I have heard that you might need to hook up two analog outputs also as that is where the signal is stored, which I have not yet done.

This is driving me round the bend.

I can see the picture is the best I have seen it, but I am not sure the sound is completely right.

Please put me out of my misery.... :oops:
Thanks

skywalker

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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 17 Oct 2017, 23:04 
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I have not seen a receiver/decoder that outputs the demodulated AC-3 RF. I'd say your Yamaha repeats out the selected optical inputs. Going straight to the Onkyo with the optical you are just decoding the PCM stereo bitstream. You need to find another external demodulator and hopefully the next one is working.

BTW the red light in the optical output is always turned on, that does mean anything about the unit actually outputting a signal.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 18 Oct 2017, 08:35 
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Thanks krbahr, I do have PCM displaying on Onkyo amp when I looked so I think you are right.

The picture is better using S-Video from 925 into Yammy and then out to Onkyo via Composite, rather than composite directly from 925 to onkyo.

So I will need a demodulator AND keep the Yammy to get the absolute best?

I have seen a Lexicon demodulator, are they better than the APD-1s

Thanks again
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 18 Oct 2017, 15:40 
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If your yamaha has six-channel analogue outputs it should be able to output the demodulated/decoded ac3 to your onkyo.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 18 Oct 2017, 17:19 
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I think it does, I will try this route, thanks
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 19 Oct 2017, 07:58 
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Tried this last night. The signal did not come through, dont know why?
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 19 Oct 2017, 12:16 
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Okay, looks like the Onkyo, despite being an 11.2 monster, has no 5.1 analogue inputs. I was in fact connecting up the Yammy 5.1 analogue outputs to the Onkyo Pre-Out jacks, so no wonder I was getting nothing.

So it looks like I will have to buy a demodulator after all?

I don't suppose anyone here has one to sell?

Thanks
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 20 Oct 2017, 04:11 
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I actually have a simple Yamaha MOD-RF1 made for 220-230VAC but I live in the US.

PM me if interested or better Email kbahr@comcast.net
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 09 Nov 2017, 16:25 
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Hi All,

I now have the Sony MOD-RF1 kindly sold to me by Kurtis. The AC-3 signal is now coming from 925 into this and I get a superb 5.1 sound on DD after it decodes over Optical. However, I tried a DTS disc (The Mask) and the Sony Demodulator does not pick this up or pass through for some reason. The only way for me to play a DTS disc is to connect an Optical cable directly from 925 to my Onkyo, which obviously means I have to replace the AC-3 Optical.

Hope this makes sense. Basically I cannot assign two Opticals e.g.. 1 & 2 to a source on the Onkyo. I have two outputs from the Demodulator, will the Sony allow both DD discs and DTS discs to be output over the Coaxial OUT and Optical OUT on the Sony?

Thanks

Nick
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 09 Nov 2017, 16:37 
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DTS isn't sent over the AC3 RF output. So you have to use a direct connection to your Onkyo Amp. I would just hookup anothrr video cable to the Amp, so you have one video input with DD and one for DTS.
There are some Demodulators which offer a digital input, the Meridian for example, they can switch between digital and AC3 depending if there is an AC3 signal or not. Then you would ony need one input on your Onkyo.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 09 Nov 2017, 16:42 
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spyral wrote:
DTS isn't sent over the AC3 RF output. So you have to use a direct connection to your Onkyo Amp. I would just hookup anothrr video cable to the Amp, so you have one video input with DD and one for DTS.
There are some Demodulators which offer a digital input, the Meridian for example, they can switch between digital and AC3 depending if there is an AC3 signal or not. Then you would ony need one input on your Onkyo.


Hi Spyral,

So you are saying I connect the Coaxial from the Demodulator to my Onkyo for DTS and the current Optical for the AC-3 DD which I am already decoding correct?

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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 09 Nov 2017, 16:48 
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No, you have to make an digital connection between your LD player and the amp. Because the AC3 RF output you're using right now is only for AC3. The coaxial on the demodulator has the same signal as the optical output.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 09 Nov 2017, 16:57 
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spyral wrote:
No, you have to make an digital connection between your LD player and the amp. Because the AC3 RF output you're using right now is only for AC3. The coaxial on the demodulator has the same signal as the optical output.


Sorry, I am being a bit thick here...

So the only way to get the DTS is from Optical from the 925 into the Optical on the amp?

If that is the case I have two Opticals going into my amp, but as I say I cannot have two opticals assigned at the same time, can I not use Coaxial for one and Optical for the other?

Thanks
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 09 Nov 2017, 17:37 
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skywalker wrote:

but as I say I cannot have two opticals assigned at the same time, can I not use Coaxial for one and Optical for the other?

Thanks

I'm not aware of any amp that lets you assign two digital inputs (coax or optical) to one source/input. Maybe this one does???

The easiest way around this is probably to use one input on the amp for AC3 and one for DTS with the relevant digital input assigned to each.

IIRC, like most LD players the 925 has dual composite and s-video outputs, so whichever you choose each audio input you use can have it's own video feed too.

As spyral says there are a few demodulators that take both the digital out (PCM/DTS) and AC3RF from the player and automatically switch between the two to send a single digital signal to the amplifier/receiver. The only ones I'm aware of are Pioneer RFD-1, Kenwood DEM-9991D, Meridian 519 and Lexicon LDD-1. These are somewhat more convenient but then also more sought after and generally more expensive.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 10 Nov 2017, 05:29 
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If you are willing to get another device I would recommend the Sony SDP-E800, it will demodulate RF as well as pass DTS through a single toslink output. there are several on ebay at the moment.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 10 Nov 2017, 15:27 
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sjoerg wrote:
If you are willing to get another device I would recommend the Sony SDP-E800, it will demodulate RF as well as pass DTS through a single toslink output. there are several on ebay at the moment.


The Sony SDP-E800 will work except that it is 120VAC. You will need a stepdown transformer for it.
Here is the link to the manual:
http://manuals.lddb.com/AC3RF_Demodulators/

It is best to read how it works before you buy one.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 10 Nov 2017, 15:57 
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Thanks for the info, but I am not looking to buy another Demodulator after just getting this one.

I have tried every which way to add two optical sources to one video source on that amp, an amp that cost close to £3000 when I bought it, it cannot do this.

I think I will have to invest in a cheap Toslink switcher. So I take the direct Toslink from 925 for DTS into that, plus the second Toslink from the Demodulator which Has the Dolby Digital, then use the one switchable connector into my amp, I think this will work?

Any thoughts on this please?

Thanks

Nick
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 10 Nov 2017, 16:28 
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That should work. But if I were you I would just use a second input on the amp with a second video connection. Then you don‘t have to buy something that isn‘t really necessary.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 10 Nov 2017, 18:01 
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Yeah, just use two inputs. That’s what everyone does. I don’t know why you can’t just do that.
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 Post subject: Re: Pioneer 925 into an Onkyo 5010 using a Yamaha DSP-A2...p
PostPosted: 10 Nov 2017, 20:44 
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I agree 2 inputs or toslink switcher is the way to go. That way no worries about voltages etc.
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