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publius
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 19 Oct 2011, 05:43 |
Hardcore fan |
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Joined: 23 Sep 2003, 18:14 Posts: 1391 Location: United States Has thanked: 39 times Been thanked: 21 times
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MUSE bandwidth compression works in a completely different way from digital broadcast or Blu-ray systems. You can read a bit about it in my article here, but what you need to know is that it sends analog values of a part of the picture elements in each frame, & reconstructs the rest from previous frames & adjacent elements in the same frame. As a result, for example, it doesn't break up into blocks or stutter they way I have seen broadcast HD do, but it may get blurry. Unfortunately, since modern film-to-video transfer is much advanced beyond that of the early to middle 1990s, Hi-Vision movie discs do not give a fair idea of what the system is capable of. Documentary or demonstration discs with a video source make a better comparison.
_________________ MUSE decoder information and user guides LD player connexion guide
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brmanuk
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 18 Nov 2011, 13:03 |
Serious fan |
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Joined: 23 Oct 2007, 21:50 Posts: 149 Location: Hong Kong Has thanked: 10 times Been thanked: 6 times
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hippiedalek wrote: Does anyone have the ability to take screenshots of MUSE discs? I can run my LD player through my PC and capture frames but I don't think I'll ever be able to get my hands on a MUSE player. I've always wondered what MUSE looks like but have never been able to find any screenshots or pictures of the TV screen at all to see what the format actually looks like. Does anyone here have any? +1 This would be fantastic! I've wanted to see a MUSE disc ever since I heard about them!
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elahrairrah
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 18 Nov 2011, 17:30 |
Young Padawan |
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005, 15:38 Posts: 3425 Location: New Jersey Has thanked: 79 times Been thanked: 152 times
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Well, if you have a projector or bright LCD or Plasma (basically a display that won't give you the refresh lines when you take a picture of it) pictures can work so you can give us some kind of idea of what it looks like. Kind of like this guy and his photos of his movies . . . Moulin Rouge D-Theater screens
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hippiedalek
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 18 Nov 2011, 17:45 |
Hardcore fan |
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Joined: 20 Feb 2011, 19:23 Posts: 1033 Location: United Kingdom Has thanked: 30 times Been thanked: 26 times
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I don't use a capture card, instead I have a device I bought from Maplin which is basically a composite to USB cable: http://www.maplin.co.uk/usb-video-and-audio-grabber-340918. This isn't the exact model but is very similar and I notice in the specification tab under output formats it lists "For Video clips: MPEG-2 (up to resolution 1080i)."
_________________ Pioneer DVL-919E, Onkyo TX-NR626, LG C8 OLED. My Collection
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elahrairrah
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 18 Nov 2011, 18:13 |
Young Padawan |
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005, 15:38 Posts: 3425 Location: New Jersey Has thanked: 79 times Been thanked: 152 times
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hippiedalek wrote: I don't use a capture card, instead I have a device I bought from Maplin which is basically a composite to USB cable: http://www.maplin.co.uk/usb-video-and-audio-grabber-340918. This isn't the exact model but is very similar and I notice in the specification tab under output formats it lists "For Video clips: MPEG-2 (up to resolution 1080i)." Only thing is you can't get HD resolutions from a composite or S-video connection, which is what that device supports. There are only a few capture cards that will capture HD content from a non-firewire connection (ie: component, RGB, HDMI, etc.), because of the movie studios trying to keep piracy down to minimum.
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publius
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 18 Nov 2011, 18:39 |
Hardcore fan |
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Joined: 23 Sep 2003, 18:14 Posts: 1391 Location: United States Has thanked: 39 times Been thanked: 21 times
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elahrairrah wrote: Well, if you have a projector or bright LCD or Plasma (basically a display that won't give you the refresh lines when you take a picture of it) pictures can work so you can give us some kind of idea of what it looks like. I do have a couple of photos which show that kind of thing, grabbed off the Internet. This one is an ad from Yahoo Japan, intended to show off the system. Here is a video of the same system, but it's low quality, so you can't really tell anything. Also the program is Sakura East Japan, & some reviewers think poorly of the two Sakura discs.
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_________________ MUSE decoder information and user guides LD player connexion guide
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Guest
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 20 Nov 2011, 07:34 |
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Here's another photo of a MUSE disc playing courtesy of AVSFORUM.com Again not a direct capture but a capture none the less.
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lons_vex
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 20 Nov 2011, 10:20 |
Advanced fan |
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Joined: 03 Oct 2003, 10:06 Posts: 729 Location: at home :p Has thanked: 59 times Been thanked: 62 times
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randomtvandmovie wrote: Here's another photo of a MUSE disc playing courtesy of AVSFORUM.com Again not a direct capture but a capture none the less. Mah well I could make pictures that bad too, if only my camera wasn't almost 12 years old by now and maxing out at 1600x1200... But that picture just looks plain bad. This could even be a vhs screenshot.
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benmbe
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 22 Nov 2011, 13:57 |
Absolute fan |
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Joined: 02 May 2006, 13:59 Posts: 1652 Location: United Kingdom Has thanked: 86 times Been thanked: 69 times
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Hello lons_vex, Some great shots there of the MUSE content, and thank you very much for taking the time to post these. I have the DTS EXPERIENCE laserdisc o which is good for demonstrations, I also have the very first DTS demo disc that was for retailers demonstrations marketing only. It has the Jurassic Park sounds amongst many others, and I also have the THX LD Demo Disc, of which are very collectable. Thank you again. P.S. I have a muse player HLD X9 but no muse decoder or disc's as of yet, so I will just have to wait and see.
_________________ Το ταξίδι για την αλήθεια κάθε σκάφος δεμένα, κατόπιν δεν είναι να ληφθούν, ή μάλλον βάδισαν
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lons_vex
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 23 Nov 2011, 00:09 |
Advanced fan |
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Joined: 03 Oct 2003, 10:06 Posts: 729 Location: at home :p Has thanked: 59 times Been thanked: 62 times
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publius wrote: So, that's Perfect Blue in those screenshots, right? Supposedly one of the MUSE demo discs includes an anime clip or two, but I don't know what it's from. Somewhere I have a photo someone took of Cardcaptor Sakura on a MUSE broadcast, 4:3 aspect ratio with black bars on the sides — not the best use of the format! Indeed some of the squeeze shots are from Perfect Blue. Too bad they never released the complete movie as squeeze+dts, I would have surely bought that. BTW, the genius behind Perfect Blue (and several other outstanding animes) Kon Satoshi, sadly died of cancer in August 2010, (aged 46 iirc). ;_; In one of his interviews on the japanese Blu-Ray of Perfect Blue, he shows the LD box Perfect Blue: Special Collection Box (1997) [PILA-9002] in some kinda conference room. The interview gets a bit weird later, when a woman (wearing a short skirt) asks him about the rape scene and they start discussing it in detail ... wtf japan Anyhow about that MUSE demo disc NHK: This is Hi-Vision [HVPR-07051], I would be very interested to know what clips exactly are on there. Maybe n$a knows such details... Or it might be Ursa Minor Blue, which I did not like one bit. If you ever plan buying Ursa, make sure the insert sheet is included, as it has technical details about film transfer etc. which you will find very interesting I bet (including some technical drawings iirc).
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publius
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Post subject: Re: How do MUSE LDs compare to HDTV and Blu-ray? Posted: 23 Nov 2011, 00:44 |
Hardcore fan |
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Joined: 23 Sep 2003, 18:14 Posts: 1391 Location: United States Has thanked: 39 times Been thanked: 21 times
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I really do want a copy of Ursa Minor Blue, mostly because it's the only animation released on MUSE. I'm not the biggest fan of the "experimental" or "art" animation, but unfortunately the rumours that Mononoke & some of the other Ghibli films were to be released never came true. (I got that from a page by someone who had bought a late release, possibly Jumanji, which had a questionnaire asking "which of these titles would you like to see on Hi-Vision LD".) So thanks for telling me about that insert, because it is exactly the kind of thing I like. If I'm not mistaken, there are neither any Squeeze anime titles nor DTS. It's disappointing, considering all the care which went into releases like the Patlabor movies & the final Wings of Honneamise release.
_________________ MUSE decoder information and user guides LD player connexion guide
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