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| sjoerg |
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Posted: 01 Jul 2018, 17:40
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| Are you getting no sound at all? Or just none in your surround speakers? The optical sends out PCM audio, the surround tracks need to be decoded by Pro Logic or similar in your receiver, otherwise it comes out in stereo, I'm sure your Sony can do this, you might need to adjust settings and/or inputs. |
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| lons_vex |
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Posted: 02 Jul 2018, 00:11
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I have the feeling that what he is trying to say is... the "surround" sound he is getting from LD, does not sound like it does from Blu Ray or his computer.
Is that it thetmaxx ? |
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| rein-o |
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Posted: 02 Jul 2018, 01:27
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Oh boy, welcome to the world of surround sound on LD.
From what I remember you need to connect the red and white and then select the pro logic settings to get the surround sound, but remember you will get dolby surround which was a 4 channel setup on some older discs.
Front left, right center and rear.
The optical will be the same just on the optical out, but you need to make sure your disc is newer to use the digital channels.
You shouldn't need any other gear unless you are doing AC-3 which I feel is not worth it.
Keep us posted on what happens.
There is a site http://www.mindspring.com/~laserdisc-forever/ which should help too. |
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| ldfan |
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Posted: 02 Jul 2018, 03:52
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Not sure about your particular Sony AV Receiver but on some older Sony AV Receivers one has to activate “Auto Format Decode (AFD)” to force any two channel audio source to activate Dolby Pro-Logic. Otherwise, the receiver only plays back two channel stereo (center and surrounds stay silent). Quite possibly, the “2ch/Multi” switch on your receiver is the same as AFD.
Also, on my Sony, SDP-EP9ES, surround processor it has a very similar functionality as AFD but it’s called “Mode” instead. In addition, Pressing the “Dolby Surround” button on the front panel will only push “surround” if the source is Dolby Digital 4.0 or 5.1 and “stereo” if the signal is PCM. I found this kind of odd when I first used this unit so it's understandable one can be get confused on how surround is activated on some AV gear.
But as signofzeta says, Pro-Logic surround will not sound as aggressive as a discrete 5.1 audio mix but overall sound quality on LD will be very good since two channel PCM sounds more robust due to lack of compression vs. lossy Dolby Digital. |
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| sjoerg |
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Posted: 02 Jul 2018, 08:56
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| Even though the laserdisc surround is not as dynamic as dolby digital it should still be apparent in the surround speakers, it is also worth noting that some surround tracks are more "aggressive" then others, I've had a few where it sounded almost more like an ac-3, one example is from dusk till dawn (not the ac-3 version). |
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| signofzeta |
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Posted: 02 Jul 2018, 15:34
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Thank you all so much. I am completely new to any kind of receiver/ surround sound stuff. Previously I've always just had a awai stereo running... Well, stereo....
I updated my receiver this morning and started digging in more looking for some of the stuff you guys mentioned... I found Neo:6 a DTS thing apparently and it defines it as extracting 7 point surround from a two channel input.... Mind blown. I had no idea that was a thing. This encoded audio stuff is a trip.
Not sure what matrix surround is, but it sounds like I'm getting closer.
Honestly at this point, it's no wonder these never took off for the average movie viewer. You guys wouldn't know it by my lack of comprehension on this topic, but I'm an enthusiastic a/v guy/ computer person, but have just never played with surround sound of any kind in my 34yrs on this Earth. Lots to catch up on.
So if you had my setup, would you run it on optical, coax, or l/r rca cables? I'm still just blown away that surround can be extrapolated from two channel analog.
Thank you for you patience with a noob
-chris
When home theater began in the 80s there was zero relationship to computer people, probably because computers were so bad back then they had no place in it. (A VCR beats a monochrome computer with 8k pretty handily). The computer people invaded in the 2000s, after DVD, when everything went digital, and they started to be attracked to things they found familiar like “megabytes” and how many bits of color information were being seen. By then everything was automatic so they never needed to put any logic into (ironically). And the prices dropped so much so fast no noobs would bother with old stuff. AV nerds mainly were audio nerds and expanded. They may be computer people (I have an uncle who left me some gear who was a computer programmer for the state) if they were left single too long. :)
There is a great deal of genius in analog electronic engineering. You should look into it. Surround Sound goes back at least to the late 40s.
As I sort of didn’t really plainly say, when using old sources they will be stereo until you switch to Pro Logic. Pro Logic is the only system really designed to be used with matrixed LD but you can also use Pro Logic II, Logic 7 or Neo 6. You’ll find the field more dynamic but there may be weird artifacts. If so, go back to regular Pro Logic. I use Neo 6 most of the time.
Neo 6 is just Sony’s branded ProLogic. It comes with many things that play DTS. Harmon Kardon invented Logic 7 I think. They do basically the same thing as the analog Dolby boxes did in the 70s but because they are digital there is more going on with steering different dynamics and of course converting it to more than four speakers. I usually use Neo 6.
As for what sounds, you’ll have to try them all and tell us. If one version of something was flat better the others in everyone’s opinion in every situation then there would just be an HDMI port and obviously that didn’t exist back then.
Also, while digital sound connections are better than analog ones overall, the DAC in you $800 player from back when people used analog sound and had huge stereos might be better than the one in your receiver that cost half as much. Probably not when the receiver is so much newer, but it happens. So sometimes analog out sounds best. You also have to hook up the analogs anyway because many discs have no digital sound and the player won’t send it over digital.
Most of us here have three audio paths to the receiver:
Analog outs: for main sound on old movies, for commentary isolated sound, etc on later discs. Also used when you like what the DAC is putting out more than the one in your receiver.
Digital outs (SPDIF or TOSLINK): for main sound on newer LDs and for DTS
AC-3 out: goes to demod, for Dolby Digital movies.
As for another question you had, if you have a digital out on this player and that receiver you can play DTS discs with no extra gear. When introduced DTS were very high end discs that needed special gear but Sony has done so well than their code is built into every receiver now. |
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| admin |
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Posted: 03 Jul 2018, 07:59
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thetmaxx wrote: Fantastic dissertation. I really appreciate it and you've clarified so many questions. I'm going to be playing with the connections and outputs/inputs and I'm sure I can impress the wife yet!
Good luck on increasing your WAF!
Julien |
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| admin |
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Posted: 09 Jul 2018, 03:07
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Just thoroughly tested Apollo 13 and True Lies with no success.
Which version of these LDs would they be? Digital audio, Dolby Digital, DTS?
Quick recap:
For surround/matrixed/ pro-logic soundtrack , output via COAX/TOSLINK (digital) or RCA L/R (analog)
Then set your A/V Received in Surround/PLII/DTS-Neo/etc. to extract the center and surround information from the stereo source.
For Dolby Digital , your DVL-7000 is actually smart to NOT let you select Analog 2/R because that would be a lot of white noise that could damage your speakers when played too loud. In that case you NEED to use the AC3RF Out plug of the player into an AC3RF compatible device and select this input on the A/V side to detect DD 5.1ch.
For DTS , nothing to do but use COAX/TOSLINK (digital) straight to your A/V Receiver, it will detect DTS 5.1ch automatically.
Would that help?
Julien |
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| admin |
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Posted: 09 Jul 2018, 04:43
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thetmaxx wrote: Just got surround sound out of Days of Thunder!
Good news!
Julien |
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