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Posted: 18 Dec 2020, 05:47 

I'm having problems powering on this player (same problems I've documented in this thread about my Onkyo player https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=8999) so I'm going to re-cap the power board. It suddenly died recently and exhibits a "squeak" from the power board when unplugged.

I've taken the board out and to my horror, the back of the PCB (green side) appears to be coated with some sort of glaze. As a result, I can't remove the caps!

Has anyone encountered this on a LaserDisc player before and has anyone got any advice? A quick Google told me there are several different types of Conformal Coating available (I assume this is what it is?), but I've no idea which one has been used on my LD player.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

EDIT: It's fixed!!

As ldfan identified, the shiny orange-tinted glaze was easily penetrated by my soldering iron. It just took a bit longer to heat up the solder.

For reference, the CLD-D780 power board in my player was model VWR-1247-B (input 240V).

I fixed it by changing all the electrolytic capacitors on the PCB, using the list of caps posted by a Reddit user in the link below:
https://www.reddit.com/r/LaserDisc/comments/4b48u8/black_waves_in_composite_signal/.

Here's the caps on the board along with Digikey reference numbers:

c6 - 250v 180uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-13309-1-ND
c11 - 250v 180uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-13309-1-ND
c12 - 50v 2.2uF ~ Digikey 493-10503-1-ND (see note)
c15 - 400v 10uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-13387-ND
c20 - 25v 2200uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-1306-ND
c21 - 25v 2200uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-1306-ND
c22 - 16v 2200uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-13390-ND
c23 - 16v 10uF (M) ~ Digikey 493-12763-1-ND
c24 - 50v 2.2uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-10503-1-ND
c25 - 50v 2.2uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-10503-1-ND
c27 - 10v 470uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-1493-ND
c28 - 25v 100uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-12560-1-ND
c29 - 10v 470uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-1493-ND
c30 - 10v 470uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-1493-ND
c31 - 16v 10uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-12763-1-ND
c32 - 35v 100uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-5925-1-ND
c35 - 50v 10uF(M) ~ Digikey 493-5915-1-ND

I replaced all of them except for c20 & c21 because they were glued to the power board and c23 and c31 because I couldn't find a suitable replacement locally. I replaced c6 and c11 with a 250v 220uF because I couldn't find 250v 180uF caps locally. These two caps were quite bulged so figured they'd be the source of the problem (however, they were not...see below)

Note: c12 was not listed in the Reddit post linked above. I replaced all the caps I could see with the exception of the ones above and it still wasn't working. I looked again at the board and spotted c12 which I had previously not noticed. When I unplugged the player, the "squeak" mentioned above seemed to be coming from this very capacitor so I removed it. Interestingly, this cap was polarized BUT the PCB indicated it was a non-polarised cap! I replaced it with a polarized cap (luckily I had a photo so I knew which way it needed to be fitted) and the beast came alive!

Hope this is of help to anyone in the future! Next project is to get the Onkyo up and running!

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Posted: 27 Mar 2021, 23:47 

Hey everyone,

After saying for so long that I was going to do it, I finally found the time to complete this pretty intricate modification to this player. Let's quickly check out the before and after pics and then I'll provide some additional details.

Front View Of The Player
https://i.vgy.me/6kXRWn.jpg

Back Panel "Before"
https://i.vgy.me/LFap2e.jpg

Back Panel "After"
https://i.vgy.me/NqOLBj.jpg

Back Panel "After" (wide view)
https://i.vgy.me/HxUJ3d.jpg

Back Panel "After" (side view)
https://i.vgy.me/RqlVLl.jpg


So now I'll break this mod down into four sections; 1) Back Panel Preparation, 2) Digital Output Mod, 3) AC-3 RF Output Mod, and 4) Adding Labels To The New Output Jacks.


Back Panel Preparation:

The first major challenge that literally took over a year to think about was how to punch out a square hole for the optical version of the Digital Output. I actually considered just doing the coaxial version of the Digital Output to simplify the mod but I really didn't want to waste the optical option that was part of the kit that I purchased. Here is the board that I used for this mod ( https://www.ebay.com/itm/CDROM-car-navigation-digital-signal-shaping-buffer-board-SPDIF-fiber-coaxial-out/323774426627 ).

https://i.vgy.me/rpwQ6q.jpg

I also considered just mounting this board simply "anywhere" inside the player and running a permanent optical cable out of a simple punch out but I thought it would look really cheesy (glad I did not do it).

In any case, let's get to the back panel. Of course, one has to remove it off of the player for the sake of ease especially since I'm going to be punching out three holes instead of the usual one hole in my previous mods. The panel came off pretty easily with only nine screws holding it in place.

https://i.vgy.me/JSpl4j.jpg

Now let's turn the panel around to see where I'm going to punch out of the holes.

https://i.vgy.me/nZnH9C.jpg

Here are the lines I drew out on the back to figure out a good placement as well as to line-up all three holes evenly....

https://i.vgy.me/xtcSNC.jpg

..... and finally a test fit to see if any obstructions could be a problem.

https://i.vgy.me/xyWugl.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/Tz50lg.jpg



The next step is to just punch out the holes with my Roper Whitney #5 Junior Hand Punch using the 3/32" punch size (about a 1/4" diameter).

https://i.vgy.me/MeqkeR.jpg

I prefer this over drilling as I feel it's a less risky option in respect to slipping or even bending the back panel if I was to apply pressure w/ a drill

I chose the following locations based on trying to line-up them up w/ the other RCA jacks on the bottom (at least on the left side) but I especially wanted my new jack openings to be straight across the top.

https://i.vgy.me/Ao1Ncm.jpg

Next, I needed to enlarge all three holes w/ a reamer as they were all just a tad too small for the RCA jacks and the optical transmitter.

https://i.vgy.me/Ex0HZh.jpg

The hole on the left is now enlarged and still looks nice and clean.

https://i.vgy.me/1cgT39.jpg


So now the challenge is to make a square opening for the optical transmitter. I first start w/ getting a template of the exact size I need and I found it on a CLUX HDMI Extractor.

https://i.vgy.me/rzPIRD.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/CIC9gq.jpg

I had the CLUX faceplate removed and centered it on the hole I needed shaved out (and used double stick tape to secure it).

https://i.vgy.me/lzIVY4.jpg


The next step is to use the reamer to enlarge the hole.....

https://i.vgy.me/bqFBzD.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/s5UvU0.jpg

.....and then I'll switch to a triangular file (Crescent Nicholson 21874NN)

https://i.vgy.me/7B2ksk.jpg
(thanks to "integra" for the advice on the file he used on his ADP-303 mod :thumbup:).


This took awhile to grind down but the results were amazing.

https://i.vgy.me/92H38j.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/V2lrcU.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/8HNt4G.jpg

Here is the optical transmitter being test fitted and it's a perfect fit.....

https://i.vgy.me/Vw5FdP.jpg

..... and now showing a screw hole punched out to mount the optical transmitter

https://i.vgy.me/L96Hdt.jpg


Now we have all three jacks mounted.....

https://i.vgy.me/EUWgoD.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/jGxOgZ.jpg

.....and tested for clearance w/ the tray retracted.

https://i.vgy.me/IyI904.jpg


Now it's time to move on to the next segment of this mod (but I'll still cover more about these jacks toward the end).


Digital Output Mod

My first step was to first remove the optical transmitter that came w/ the board as the original transmitter came with no mounting hole (the intent of this board was to use the board itself as the basis of a mount but that wasn't going to work here). Also, I had the RCA jack removed as I did not like the way it extended out and I wanted it to match the other RCA jack for the AC3-RF Out.

https://i.vgy.me/R2lWYv.jpg

Here is the board now w/ the new optical transmitter now soldered in and I also had hot glue added to the sides to strengthen its connection to the board (the transmitter housing is not well secured to the transmitter itself so the glue was necessary).

https://i.vgy.me/MMhkLA.jpg

Moving on, I soldered in a coax wire to the pad where the RCA jack used to reside so I could connect it up to the new jack I have mounted to the back panel.

https://i.vgy.me/HHf3bx.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/vSPwxl.jpg
(red arrows indicate hot glue to add additional mounting strength for the board to the back panel)


Now it's time to tap the digital signal from the player to the board. The interface is right off the Sony CXD2500AQ DSP as shown here.

https://i.vgy.me/S9ahL0.jpg

Pin 60 will be the tap to provide the signal while Pin 59 is just a verification that the digital output is set to "on" (if there was 0 vdc on pin 59, I would have to jumper a 5vdc point to it). Fortunately, it was getting 5vdc so I didn't have to make any changes. The kit included a coax wire that was pre-tinned and I had it soldered in from the opposite side.

https://i.vgy.me/5o5Lcb.jpg
(coax wire to pin 60 and green wire to GND)

Moving on, we'll also need a 5vdc power supply so that was as simple as finding some jumpers that were already labeled.

https://i.vgy.me/UE4ACK.jpg

The Digital Output is now complete and now it’s time to move on to the next step.


AC-3 RF Output Mod

So I'll be using my 2nd scratch built AC3 board that I built over two years ago (can't believe it's been that long).

Top
https://i.vgy.me/T6XUSz.jpg

Bottom
https://i.vgy.me/ZPHJS3.jpg

I won't get into details regarding the board itself since I covered it in this previous post. >>> https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=7827

The focus here is mounting the board and running the wires.

First step, I needed to punch a hole into the board so I can install a plastic stand off....

https://i.vgy.me/jIn1KK.jpg

.... and put some electrical tape on the bottom of the board as a precaution against shorting in case it falls on to the main board.

https://i.vgy.me/hGD8fH.jpg


Next up, time to pick a place to mount the board and I chose a location toward the front of the player that limits the length the AFM signal needs to travel to it (it was mentioned in instructions I have received in the past to keep this cable under 10" as a means to reduce signal loss but I'm not sure how definitive that advice is).

https://i.vgy.me/aUESqY.jpg

The AFM point is tapped from the audio board (hangs vertical on the right side of the player) off of the middle pin of transistor Q351 which is located right before the band pass filters of the CX chip.

https://i.vgy.me/Wm9cBC.jpg

I had my coax cable soldered from the other side as such and also had the shielding grounded via the green wire.

https://i.vgy.me/VtMUvm.jpg

The remaining wires needed for the board are +5vdc (red), -5vdc (blue), Mute (yellow), GND (black), and another RF cable to the RCA jack. Here are images of all of them connected up.....

https://i.vgy.me/an8drZ.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/blTTSi.jpg

..... and the AC3-RF board w/ all the wires now connected.

https://i.vgy.me/ABILYe.jpg


Now a wide shot showing the entirety of the two mods.

https://i.vgy.me/D3GCdj.jpg


And finally, a shot of how much clearance there was w/ the tray. It looks close to hitting it but in reality there is still plenty of room.

https://i.vgy.me/J3426E.jpg


I tested the board w/ an AC3 LD and confirmed the signal was passing to my Demodulator / Processor and I did get a voltage output on the RCA jack at around 4.3 volts w/ the mute control operating correctly to kill that power on pause and stop (I really do feel if anyone does this mod to really try and get your mute control to work as a means to prevent extraneous noise on your speakers during start up and side changes).


Adding Labels To The New Output Jacks

So finally we're near the end and believe it or not this was somewhat a complicated mess. I originally wanted the Digital Outs to emphasize their use to transfer both PCM and DTS encoding but space between the jacks and my pickiness to maintain the font size made that difficult as you will see.

https://i.vgy.me/YoAbUq.jpg

https://i.vgy.me/JRTIR9.jpg

I ended up w/ the labeling you see @ the top of this post and overall I'm pretty happy with it. I was trying for all three labels to have the same height so they looked even across. Unfortunately, I think I made a total of four attempts to get it perfect and in the end I got tired of trying.


I had the player tested on AC3 & DTS LDs' and DTS CD. The mod worked as it should and it was thrilling knowing that I was listening to a sound codec that over a week ago the player was incapable of playing. And since it's a CD Changer as well, now I have the convenience of playing multiple DTS (or standard) CD titles without getting up from my seat (this is actually the only CD Changer I've ever owned). Picture quality wise, this player is definitely not impressive as it is a bit noisy but it still holds up fine (especially with discs that have good mastering). I'll be using this player soon on my cheap set-up so I can pull my ProScan out for some much delayed minor maintenance and further test the player.

Hope everyone enjoyed the post. 8-)

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Posted: 29 Jul 2021, 13:04 

I can confirm replacement of just the one capacitor the C12 2.2uF 50V Electrolytic has fixed the PSU for my D780 !

Standby light now on and unit lights up and powers on as it should.

However I do have another issue ..seeing error U1 on the display?!... when powering on the tray will go in - you hear whirring and then it spits the tray back out..repeating the process if you let it.

Im hoping this is a VEB1184 belt replacement fix !? -

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Posted: 04 Aug 2021, 00:08 

Hello LD fans,
after I ran out of original parts of the VNL1779, I invested time and money to reproduce this spare part.
In cooperation with a company which specializes in 3D printing and 3D scanning, an original part was digitized with a high-accuracy 3D scanner and an STL file was created with it.
After a few changes to the print file, a fully functional replica could be produced. (See attachments.)

3D manufacturing process: stereolithography (SLA)
Material used: Somos® EvoLVe 128 white
This material is a durable, tough plastic that is particularly suited for parts that must withstand mechanical loads.

Please understand that I'm not going to publish my 3D print file because it cost me about € 250 to get it created.
(Unfortunately, I am unable to create and edit 3D files myself.)
Additionally, due to the overall construction, the part can not be printed with regular consumer 3D printers.

However, if you are interested in purchasing replicated motor holder I will sell the part for € 15, regardless of the higher development costs.
Just send me a pm for details.

Here is my video on YouTube showing the part:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ay3X62CcWT8

Information (Dec. 2023): None of my manufactured parts are available anymore.

But to my own surprise, I found a remaining quantity of the original packed VNL1779 the stock of an unknown company in Nov. 2023
Look here: https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=7781&p=135750#p135750

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Posted: 08 Aug 2021, 04:16 

It is not uncommon for motors to completely detach from a pickup after the M-Holder shatters. Using very high-gauge wire and a very small amount of solder, it is possible to jump the leads as seen in the attached image. I hope this helps someone :thumbup:.

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Posted: 08 Sep 2021, 13:51 

Just fixed my Pioneer CLD-D780/604 - replaced the original broken grey Mholder with the replacement Mholder I purchased from user Oppelix

Worked a treat !

First time Ive changed an Mholder..it was a lot easier than I feared - the easiest repair yet!..the replacement Mholder fitted perfectly...fixing holes lined up - cogs lined up...perfect.

First time tonight I've been able to watch discs with the D780 using Side B ....awesome ! (another junk player fixed)

Tried to take some photos of the new installed Mholder tonight..but lighting isnt great ...will post a couple of photos when in daylight.

Cheers to Oppelix for allowing me to make this player play properly again!

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Posted: 09 Sep 2021, 00:28 

Couple of Pictures of the Pioneer CLD-D780's Broken Mholder and its New Shiny Replacement.

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Posted: 12 Oct 2021, 05:42 

david4 wrote:
Can anybody please give some kind advice and/or point me in the right direction.


You could check for fuses on the Service Manual here:

https://manuals.lddb.com/LD_Players/Yamaha/CDV/

Julien

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Posted: 12 Oct 2021, 14:17 

I own a Yamaha CDV-W901 laserdisc player (which is a Pioneer clone, possibly Pioneer CLD-D604).
It is a CLD-D504 + optical out. VWR1256 would be the US power supply, with VWR1268 being international. What voltage does it say on the notch on back of player? Just curious if someone swapped this out themselves or if Yamaha made an international version.

Remove the power supply if you can. VWR1256 can come out without de-soldering, not sure about VWR1268. Check IC1 and IC2 for continuity. They are usually denoted on bottom with white rectangle around them. If those are good, check F1 through F6.

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Posted: 12 Oct 2021, 15:56 

My worry / question is, since my unit's standby light is lit when plugged in, maybe some power is getting to the unti so any tests I do will be come back as "OK" or maybe some fuses/diodes (etc) are preventing the unit from "turning on" but allow the standby light to be lit.
It won't affect any fuse reading. The semi-functional state was why I said check IC1 & 2 first. They are ICPs and can be tested exactly like fuses but look like transistors with only two legs.

Unplug the unit before opening the unit and keep it unplugged while checking the fuses and ICPs.

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Posted: 13 Oct 2021, 23:49 

It should all be nicely labeled on the bottom. You can see F3, F4, F5, IC2 in the attached image.

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Posted: 15 Oct 2021, 06:44 

Probably stands for something like Line and Neutral.

To check continuity, you just need to touch one lead (either lead- order doesn't matter) of your multimeter to one of the two solder joints of the fuse/ICP and then other lead to the other. Basically each rectangular box with a "~" symbol in it. i.e. in the attached image you'd check for a beep across the two solder joints in the box to the left of "IC2", etc. Also make sure you are checking IC1/IC2 not C1/C2.

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Posted: 15 Oct 2021, 08:16 

I repaired one player with one blown ICP where the focus was not bouncing up and down like that but was slowly increasing.

I have the Mitsubishi equivalent of this player where it might have been doing exact same thing as you were describing. I think it had a cracked FLKY board and severed leads to the carriage motor next to the lens and on top of all that someone had been in it tinkering so I wrote it off as a parts unit. I'll see if I can dig it back out and provide more info. In the meantime, (with the unit unplugged) I'd make sure all cables are properly seated, nothing is torn/cracked etc and then look at CN101 1-4 on FLKY, but you have to be careful you don't touch any of them together while measuring.

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Posted: 20 Oct 2021, 00:27 

How would I remove this ribbon cable from FLKY ASSY ? Just gently pull it out ?

When measuring CN101 (1-4) on the ribbon cable - I'm guessing I'll be using the multimeter with positive and negative on either end (just like testing the fuses) ?
Cable pulls straight out, but leave it in.

For this, instead of checking continuity you need to check voltage. The contact points on FLKY are small, but it is imperative you don't short anything while measuring.

I found my unit with similar issue- it was indeed missing a chunk from the FKLY. I'll have to dive in further to it later this week.

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Posted: 20 Oct 2021, 15:22 

So my point question is this. Would any issue in the FLKY ASSY board be after a point where the signal from the power button and the signal from the Play / Open buttons meet ?

It could be before or after. Some of these buttons can also function as power buttons- a convenience feature.

I watched the video, but that is a single pulse. You were observing it repeating, correct? I've seen both happen.

Another thing to try is unplug the smaller, 7 pin cable that runs to the front from main board and see if anything changes. Anytime you unplug/plug a cable, the unit needs to be unplugged from wall/power strip.

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Posted: 21 Oct 2021, 05:10 

To me it really seems like something is awry on the FLKY board. This part is more vulnerable during rough handling/shipping. Cracks, stuck buttons, etc. If voltages inbound are sane, I'd go ahead and unplug everything going to the front panel and unscrew the boards there to take a look at the other sides. It looks like there are four in there.

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Posted: 22 Oct 2021, 14:20 

Quick Update: Been using my CLD-D780 most often with the new installed 3D Printed MHolder from user Oppelix - its now in use for over a month...and posting that it is performing beautifully!

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Posted: 26 Oct 2021, 04:08 

Could very well just boil down to a capacitor issue, etc.

Possible case here could be you attempting to repeatedly turn it on, the unit getting warmer and capacitor ESR lowering, etc. Ton of different explanations though- this is just an example.

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Posted: 16 Nov 2021, 15:08 

So, it's as you say - some ESR levels in the capacitors ( on the power-board ? ).
Some better info here: https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/350796/do-bad-capacitors-work-less-in-the-cold

Next the step would be to: get an ESR meter, check the capacitors, find out which ones are causing this issue, remove them and solder in new ones.

I don't have an ESR meter, nor do I know how to solder -- have watched a few youtube videos - :) or take it to an electrician who could hopefully fix it.
Probably cheaper to just do a blind recap of power board. I'd order ones for FLKY too in the event power supply recap doesn't resolve it.

It isn't too bad- the most time consuming part is measuring existing capacitors and noting their values for ordering. You have to ensure you orient them the right way (like batteries) and avoid damaging board while removing them (I use solder sucker, some use braid).

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 Post subject: Re: Power supply and watts
Posted: 18 Sep 2023, 13:08 

You can try to do whatever you want but if what you’re suggesting is even physically possible and the ratings are accurate then you’re asking for trouble. That’s a pretty big discrepancy. Bigger is OK, smaller isn’t.

I’d suspect that it would have issues starting LDs and changing sides, since those are the peak current demand times for an LD player. Audio screwups, discs not reading right, missing TOC info, no DTS sync. It would probably run the middle of a CLV side just fine but could flake out during the sustained current demand of a CAV side.

It could also potentially fail the PSU since these poor things are already decades old so combining that will over work…

VERICT: Don’t do it unless it’s a Sony. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Power supply and watts
Posted: 18 Sep 2023, 16:21 

If the schematics say you can then its OK if not then no.
These are made to specific electronic standards.
Some capacitors can be changed, microfarad values need to be exact. Voltages can't be lower than originals.

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 Post subject: Re: Power supply and watts
Posted: 18 Sep 2023, 23:00 

a power supply could have multiple rails with different DC Voltage outputs each with different current ratings. If any one of these are off, it will damage the electronic. Manufacturers won't waste pennies putting an oversized power supply unless it is some mega expensive audiophile device. If the nameplate rating is 37W, it most likely very well needed 37W to operate.

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Posted: 30 Sep 2023, 11:01 

Glad to hear!

Truncate means the value is WAY too high, maybe you forgot the . in the decimal value?

Added => LG BP550

Julien

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Posted: 27 Oct 2023, 22:28 

In case anyone stumbles across this forum, I just wanted to say that ordering a new M-Holder from thelaserparts store on eBay did fix the problem. The plastic rods that hold the gears in place on the original had both cleanly snapped off. The new M-Holder works perfectly. Thanks to it and a new belt the player has been restored to its original glory. Thanks to ldfan for his helpful comments.

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Posted: 29 Oct 2023, 01:42 

Got it back online with Ethan's 3D part. Thanks for the help and guidance, another player saved.
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