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 Post subject: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 28 Aug 2019, 20:41 
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I notice in many threads you guys say you have all 3 paths connected from LD (and demodulator) to your receivers.
I don't have in or out Toslink connected to my Lexicon decoder & don't seem to be missing out on anything. (am I?)
My DTS discs seem to pass signal through the Lexicon just fine & the DTS lights up on the receiver (yamaha RX-Z7) & plays fine.

I do have to toggle the Optical/COAX sw on the lexicon to the (empty) Optical setting in order to play old analog only discs.
I was afraid hooking up the Toslink would mess that ability up & force me to go a few levels deep into the receiver menu to manually select analog. "Auto" doesn't work because the receiver will always see some signal on the digital path out of the demodulator.
Am I missing anything?

Thanks!
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 28 Aug 2019, 23:24 
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Yep, you’re missing analog sound which is essential for many LDs.
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 28 Aug 2019, 23:44 
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signofzeta wrote:
Yep, you’re missing analog sound which is essential for many LDs.


Ah, wait, I see it now.

Most RF demods only demod and don’t have the features yours does so:

1) analog
2) digital
3) AC-3
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 29 Aug 2019, 07:58 
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I'm not quite sure what you are describing in your set-up. :think:

I assume you are telling us you are using a Lexicon, LDD-1 which is an AC3-RF Demodulator that accepts AC3-RF, Coax Digital, and Optical Digital inputs. You should be connecting your LD player's AC3-RF output and digital output (either optical or coaxial but not both) to this Lexicon and then from the Lexicon run a coaxial output to the AV Receiver. In addition, you should be running the LD player’s analog left and right outputs to a set of inputs on the AV Receiver. Look at this diagram on page 6 from the Lexicon manual.....

https://manuals.lddb.com/AC3RF_Demodula ... 0,-154,393


If your AV Receiver is built like many of the current designs (I know your Z7 can do this), you should be able to assign a digital input to an analog input of your choosing. And if this is done correctly, you can switch between digital and analog inputs on the AV Receiver by simply turning the Lexicon on (for digital) and off (for analog) assuming you leave your AV Receiver in "auto" mode for the audio input to sense an active signal (wait.... just realized the LDD-1 has no actual power button so you’ll have to put its power on a switched outlet to do this trick).
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 29 Aug 2019, 17:56 
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This all presents a bit of a pickle. I would have preferred if Pioneer (and the other player makers) had shut down the Digital Output on discs that contained only analog audio. That way Auto-Detecting receivers would properly select soundtracks according to discs.
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 29 Aug 2019, 20:28 
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I agree with you on that Blam; too many audio options and no easy way to get them all to work effortlessly.

However, thinking about his some more, a better solution than the one I mentioned before would be to assign the LD player two inputs on the AV Receiver. It could be something like this...

BD/HD DVD (all digital) >> Run composite video 1 from LD player to AV Receiver on BD/HD DVD input. Then run AC3-RF out and a digital out (either optical or coaxial) to the Lexicon and then from that a Coaxial Digital Out to the Z7 on a Coaxial Digital Input assigned to BD/HD DVD input.

DVD (all analog) >> Run composite video 2 from LD Player to AV Receiver on DVD input. Then run analog left and right also to DVD input on Yamaha.

After this is done, you can play back all three formats with just switching the appropriate inputs on the Yamaha and Lexicon.
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 29 Aug 2019, 23:44 
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blam1 wrote:
This all presents a bit of a pickle. I would have preferred if Pioneer (and the other player makers) had shut down the Digital Output on discs that contained only analog audio. That way Auto-Detecting receivers would properly select soundtracks according to discs.


So you think most LD owners in the 90s needed this in preparation for auto-detecting stuff that hadn’t been invented yet? There was no conceivable reason to shut the LED down so it never did. This was true of CD players so it became true of LD players.

Personally, I’m not interested in any auto switching because it’s never going to be correct. Just switch it manually. How hard is it? Are you out of digital ins or something? There are three different soundtracks on an LD (potentially) so at some point you’re going want any one of them, so you the viewer are the only one that can tell your gear what you want.
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 30 Aug 2019, 00:26 
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Thanks guys. I think you answered all my questions. Unfortunately as you guessed I do not have enough free inputs on the receiver to use more than one for my LD, but that was a good suggestion.

Yes, I'm running AC3RF & SPDIF into the decoder so optical input is unplugged. Then analogs run straight from LD to same input on the receiver as demodulator's COAX out. This basically gives me the same functionality as if I installed a power switch as suggested. Since the demodulator disconnects the COAX signal when flipping the front panel switch to "Optical", no signal is present on the receiver's COAX in. The auto mode then correctly selects the analog inputs. Not a bad setup. Well, anyway that gets me off of the couch an extra time now & then when I forget to change it while going from one disc type to another. I just have to be careful because I can end up with the AC-3 going into the analog on the receiver. (wakes me up! no damage so far.)
I already re-labeled "Optical" to say "Analog" to help me remember.

If I were to do this with the Yamaha remote it would be:
Menu
move up or down to:
Input
OK
move up or down to:
LD
Sub menu
move up or down to:
Audio
OK
...and finally move up or down between Auto, HDMI, COAX/Optical, or Analog
OK
Menu (to exit)

I'll save that for when I'm sick, broken leg, old, or all 3! lol.


Thanks again!
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 30 Aug 2019, 00:37 
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I always use a separate input for RF and Digital Coax. Rf demodulators that auto switch always favors the AC-3 soundtrack over PCM. In many cases PCM tracks are the better choice for me. If I only have RF demodulator handle switching for me then it would be impossible to select PCM tracks over AC-3 without disconnecting wires.

I have to admit I use multiple audio and video processors. I handle all control with automation systems. I have more inputs than I need and switching inputs are easily handled by macros on my automation system which I write the scripts myself. It can still be handled with minimal means without all this.

All LD players have dual video outputs. You can wire each one into a different input on your AVR and wire one from the RF demodulator and the other with Digital Coax. If you want to watch your film in AC-3, use input 1 and use input 2 for PCM soundtracks.
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 30 Aug 2019, 18:55 
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ldfan wrote:
I agree with you on that Blam; too many audio options and no easy way to get them all to work effortlessly.

However, thinking about his some more, a better solution than the one I mentioned before would be to assign the LD player two inputs on the AV Receiver. It could be something like this...

BD/HD DVD (all digital) >> Run composite video 1 from LD player to AV Receiver on BD/HD DVD input. Then run AC3-RF out and a digital out (either optical or coaxial) to the Lexicon and then from that a Coaxial Digital Out to the Z7 on a Coaxial Digital Input assigned to BD/HD DVD input.

DVD (all analog) >> Run composite video 2 from LD Player to AV Receiver on DVD input. Then run analog left and right also to DVD input on Yamaha.

After this is done, you can play back all three formats with just switching the appropriate inputs on the Yamaha and Lexicon.



This is provided you've got the extra inputs. I've got an HLD-X9 using 2 (Muse and NTSC PCM+AC3) and 1 each for DVL-919 (Analog/PCM/DTS/AC3), LD-W1, VP-1000, DirecTV, XBox, Wii, VHD and the front panel inputs for whatever player I happen to be fixing this week. :)
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 Post subject: Re: AC-3 & Using only 2 paths to Receiver.
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 01:26 
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blam1 wrote:
This is provided you've got the extra inputs.



This is definitely my challenge as well :).

I've had to make do w/ taking advantage of my Denon's input assignment feature and literally double up some of the inputs (e.g.: my "HDP" input has a Blu-Ray player on HDMI and a DVD Audio player on Component Video - S/PDIF - 6 ch Ext) to free up resources

In any case, my LD player works perfectly w/ my current set-up to provide all three audio options w/ ease of switching (AC3-RF and optical to my Sony, SDP-EP9ES and analog L/R directly to the Denon). Later on, I will be dropping my CLD-3030 and swap in my CLD-D704 and CLD-D703 w/ built in AC3 Demodulator to finally get my "2nd" dual player auto reverse set-up completed.

Isn't it great too have too much equipment. :D
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