Thanks Disclord for clarifying my comb filter type for the DVL-91.

Okay Krbahr, I'm not sure I'm following you. I said that I'm using the composite output on both units, not the S-Video. Are you saying that the DNR is applied on composite? or just S-video? For the CLD 97. And if the CLD 97 does not re-combine the Y/C on the composite output, how do you adjust that for chroma noise? I'm using a Black Magic Intensity hub for lossless capture. No, settings to adjust as far as chroma noise. Please give me a further lesson on what you mean by discrete D/A for the CLD 97 composite output?
Are you talking about sound when you say discrete D/A?
FYI, When doing the comparison the DNR was off on the CLD 97, don't no what that matters, because I think that only applies to the S-video?
Also, does the 3 line comb filter on the CLD 97 get applied to both the composite and S-video outputs. My understanding is that it does, unfortunately.

Thanks
Elvis

Thank You
Elvis

Again, you are right on the money

The DNR is applied to the signal after it is digitized and yes it is applied to all outputs. What happens to most players is the 8 bit digitized signal is separated and processed then the chroma part goes to a D/A circuit and the lumance goes to another D/A circuit. Then the two analog signal go to the outputs. Then a simple analog combine circuit mixes the analog lumance and chroma to make the composite output. So this is the process in the DVL players (minus the DVL-91 which I cannot confirm but the DNR does affect the composite output) and the CLD-D704. So if you adjust the independent chroma analog output that also affects the composite out since it is used to make the composite.

Now the CLD-97, after applying DNR, sends a digital chroma to one D/A circuit, digital lumance to another D/A circuit, and digital composite to another D/A circuit. So you cannot adjust the chroma gain independently for the component to get it out of spec like the other players.

Thanks, Krbahr. Good information.
So let me see if I have this straight concerning the CLD-97. First point the analog disc is digitized. Next, the signal has the Comb filter and if chosen the DNR applied. Next the digital signal is split, 1st split, the digital chroma/digital lumance are separated and sent to their respective D/A circuits then a Y/C conversion is done for the S-Video output. 2nd split an unseparated digital signal is continued on to it's own D/A circuit, to be sent out on the composite output.
Is this how it flows?
My next question is then, why do so many so called video transfer experts say to use the composite signal only when the receiving device has a superior comb filter? To skip the bad Y/C conversion on the LD's S-video, ONLY? What's the point if the comb filter of the CLD 97 has already been applied to the composite digital signal, to goose again the analog output (reapply a 3D comb filter in the receiving device)? If the DNR and comb filter are applied on both outputted signals of the LD player, why would anyone use the S-video output? Considering that laserdisc is a natural composite medium. Maybe, because the receiving device handles an S-video signal better than composite?
Thanks for the info,
Elvis

I'm on my laptop right now so I don't have the file with me, but supposedly a signal that's been Y/C split can be put back together with little distortion if done by a like filter. It makes sense in practice because you can see improvements on the S&W test pattern when using an external comb filter. You should ask Disclord for details.

Comb filter, three line digital, are all ways to separate composite to Y/C. Then Y/C is split further until you get RGB for displays. So every time you split composite to Y/C you need the best product to do that. Many time people mistake the ADAPTIVE processing like in the CLD-99, LD-S9, HLD-X0, HLD-X9 with comb filters. Adaptive processing is an extra step to analyze the NTSC video signal and remove artifacts, Black/White patterns like football umpires shirts from being miss-interpreted as chroma information, have diagonal lines be smooth and not stair-steps, etc.

Mixing is much easier, it is adding two signals together. Separating to get what was originally mixed is harder.

Okay, I think I am following you here. In my example of the flow of signal in the CLD 97, the adaptive filter is applied to the digital signal first, then the optional DNR. Not until the Y/C conversion on the S-video output is a 3 line comb filter applied. Therefore the 3 line comb filter is not applied to the composite output on the CLD 97? Correct?
Thanks
Elvis

I've come to the conclusion after additional reading about the CLD 97 and observation in capture, that my best captures are from the S-video output on the 97, direct to the capture hub. Reason being, because every time I try to use an external device to apply a superior 3D comb filter to the composite signal from the 97, I end up with interference such as subtle diagonal lines. Why? I don't get electrical interference on the 97. Could it be the DNR in these external devices that is causing this additional noise. Anyone here have luck using an external device for applying a 3D Comb filter to the composite signal on a CLD 97?
Thanks
Elvis

P.S. I've also come to the conclusion that my prior experiment of comparing the two LD players the DVL 91 and the CLD 97 we're misjudged. That the lighter images or colors out of the DVL-91 we're not correct. But that the darker colors in the CLD 97 we're correct just darker and richer in color.

What external devices have you used?

-Tried a few pass thru devices (composite out to pass thru device, S-video out on pass thru device to capture device)
1. Toshiba DVD recorder D-KR2 2. Panasonic ES10 DVD recorder 3. JVC SR-V10U VHS player
even tried direct composite into my Black Magic intensity pro hub, but it was a virtual tie with a slight leaning towards the S-Video capture. My understanding is that the pro hub has only a 2D comb filter, although I have been unable to verify that with any source other than hear say and observation.

Hello,
I have a DLV-90 and a DLV-91. I like both players for their looks and performance.
Unfortunately my DLV-91 has stopped working.
The trays open for laser discs and cd/dvd's. The laser carriage rotates and the laser moves back and forth to read the disc. The disc, cd or laser disc, does not spin and the front panel reads "No Disc"
Apologies in advance if I am posting this on the wrong thread. Anyone in the forum have this issue?
Regards,
Marc

I would post this in the repair section. Someone can probably help you.

Thanks, I will post in repair section.