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 Post subject: Alternatives for physical media when it’s no longer produced
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 18:35 
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Media sections in brick and mortar stores are shrinking or disappearing each passing year. Perhaps soon the disc production will stop and the streaming media will be the only option. I am sure the used market for physical media will live forever however what alternatives do we have for new movies? I compiled a list of online streaming and download services. Also listed media players to access them.

Hardware:

High Dynamic Range(HDR): HDR10, HDR10+, Dolby Vision (DV), Hybrid Log Gamma (HLG) formats exist, uses metadata for brightness cues

HDR10: Free license, 10 bit encoded video, static metadata
HDR10+: same as HDR10 but adds dynamic(per scene) metadata
DV: Requires Dolby license, 12 bit encoded video, dynamic metadata
HLG: Free license, similar to HDR10, designed for broadcast TV

HDMI 2.0: 10.2Gbps bandwitdh = up to 4K24-HDR in 12 bit, 4K60 in 8 bit
HDMI 2.0b: 18 Gbps bandwitdh = up to 4K60-HDR in 12 bit

Dolby Atmos: Object based audio format, 7.1.4ch is typical but 9.1.24 exist in very high end setups.

Apple TV 4K:

HDMI 2.0b, HDR, DV and Dolby Atmos capable. Includes almost all major streaming services. Itunes store and upcoming Apple TV+ are Apple TV exclusives. Resolution is fixed at 4K which means it upscales all lower resolution content. Frame rate auto switches between 24 and 60 frames depending on content. Includes Plex app.

Tivo Bolt:

HDMI 2.0b, HDR and Dolby Atmos capable. Netflix, Prime, Vudu, Hulu, HBO Go, Starz and a few others. Includes Plex app. Universal search is its biggest advantage. You can search for a movie, artist, or director and it will list you where their content is available including cable tv. For example, do a search for the movie “Alien”, it will tell you Fox will show it on Thursday at 7 pm and it’s available to rent and buy from Amazon Prime and Vudu. Another major advantage of TiVo Bolt is its source direct mode. It will display contents in their original resolution and frame rate. Also has a 500GB to 3TB built in storage to record cable or on air TV.

Software:

Netflix:

Ton of Netflix produced exclusive content. More and more Netflix produced content added each month but other content size is shrinking rapidly. It might end up having Netflix produced content only soon. A lot of 4K HDR content with Dolby Atmos. Monthly subscription for unlimited streaming. Highly compressed video and audio. Netflix has the worst audio out of all content providers. I believe the bitrates are below 300kbps on most cases.

Amazon Prime:

Ton of Prime produced exclusive content. More Amazon produced content added each month but other content is still sizable. A lot of 4k HDR content with Atmos audio. Annual subscription for unlimited streaming but some content is still extra for rent or buy (typically newer movies). Higher quality video and audio in general than Netflix.

Kaleidescape:

14,000+ titles library. All content is bit perfect exact copies of DVDs, Blu-rays and 4K UHD Blu-rays. Unfortunately requires a Kaleidescape media player which is $4500-6000. Movies need to be dowloaded to the player first which can take an hour or so. Standard player can store 150 4K titles. Kaleidescape servers can be added to expand this. No monthly fee but movies are for rent or buy. Pricing is similar to physical media ($25-35 per titles). Advantages: instant access to your library, excellent user interface which makes picking movies fun and easy, best video and audio quality with zero compression. Saves space. Multi room play is possible with multiple players. Multiple players can share content from each other and expand overall storage space.



This list is incomplete. I will add more information later.


Last edited by substance on 06 Jul 2019, 01:38, edited 3 times in total. _________________
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 18:38 
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That player cost seems nuts to me but they are clearly targeting a market I am not part of. I'm not too worried about this because I mostly don't care about new movies.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 20:05 
Jedi Master
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I'll just buy it from Asian countries, they will always have physical media.
Not everybody in those gigantic Asian countries will have streaming, they are still waiting for refrigerators........
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 20:08 
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Even if physical media will die at some point we will still be able to buy films physically, just not new ones. Though I will say that the day I lose the opportunity to even buy films physically, I will quit watching films in my home. Don't see any point to spend time watching films in my home when there's nothing I can hold, that's no fun at all. I will just keep on watching films in the theater then.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 20:14 
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rein-o wrote:
I'll just buy it from Asian countries, they will always have physical media.
Not everybody in those gigantic Asian countries will have streaming, they are still waiting for refrigerators........

I find it weird that they're pushing for streaming so hard in the US when the internet speeds are so abysmal in huge parts of the country. It's like people don't even live outside major metropolitan areas.

Hell, there are places where the only internet connection available is dial-up, and I can't even imagine what it must be like to try using modern internet with a speed that's not even 56kbs!
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 20:15 
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It wouldn't surprise me if Japan is one of the last hold outs.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 21:01 
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Yeah, internet speeds here are all over the place and slower than they can be.
I know mine is faster than dial up but slower than other, I can still stream videos on youtube but that's about all I do, no other films or services.

I was thinking more of India and other smaller places like Thailand, Malaysia etc. They will always have physical media.
Look at the bootlegs that are on the internet now from these places, not India but others.
So many and they even make their own not just copying other companies but their own translations albeit bad but still they have done it.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 21:37 
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I think 5 years is chicken little level paranoia. The idea that litterally all media will be gone is assuming a lot. It’s assuming that every publisher of all media in the world would rather stop manufacturing it that cater to even a small market and that’s...you don’t know that. Nobody does. And I feel very very confident that LP and even CD will still exist so let’s be clear that you’re really talking about streaming killing BR.

When streaming doesn’t suck major D for selection and the entire planet has access to 4G wireless with no data cap, then maybe we can talk. As it is %99 of all classic movies are not available streaming so unless publishers love flushing their entire back catalog they’re going to have to improve the streaming or keep making the discs. A large part of the world still pays a toll for internet, either they have a cap or they pay by the byte/minute. Netflix only works where internet is unlimited.

Things are in a major state of transition right now but it needs to be understood that Netflix particularly but all of the major streaming services are losing money on the actual product. If you buy three or four Blu-ray in a year you give more money to discs that Netflix. Netflix in particular is spending INSANE money developing tons and tons of shows and more than a few people are wondering when they are going to become a profitable company instead of the Tesla of streaming (that is, hoodwink more investors every year, get more subscribers every year, but still ultimately spending more on the customer than the customer is spending on them). And now Apple is getting in on it...it’s going to be interesting and very very expensive.

We will see a lot of stuff not making it to disc, as is the case already, but “ALL” media, or even all video is...not realistic. It may get as bad as it was trying to buy vinyl in the 90s but it won’t be completely gone unless the whole world loses interest in movies.

And yeah, Japan will be the last holdout but honestly I think China could be an even bigger factor. There is quite the scene there now for audiophiles and collectors.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 23:20 
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How exactly is the amount of Video-and Audio Philes in the US? I thought we would have a bigger market so that physical media would still continue.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2019, 23:33 
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We have more per-capita collector for sure but China is 4x the size of the US and growing and the US is basically at it’s Fin de siècle. I think we will have a very strong record collecting scene for at least until my generation is dead and frankly some of the 90s kids buy a lot of music too. When they hit middle age they’ll need decent gear so in like 2035 look forward to a turntable revival.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 07 Mar 2019, 02:32 
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Now that I think about it, I messed up. I dismissed the notion rather than provide an actual list of alternative ways of getting stuff when physical media is dead.

There is an answer, and it’s to just pirate everything. If something exists it can be copied even if discs were never made. A great example of this is when you find torrents of all new HD masters of stuff that doesn’t exist on a disc yet because it was made for cable or streaming or something. These are sourced from internal leaks usually but there are ways of capturing anything and everything. If the home video industry does in fact just kill itself and close up shop forever in T-minus 5 years then that’s your solution.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 07 Mar 2019, 03:26 
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That's exactly what I was saying.
Those Asian countries will get the files and make factory pressed DVDs in China, Thailand etc.
I remember seeing those Asian releases of films like Iron Man or other commercial USA film in Chinatown back in NYC
and they weren't even released in the USA yet.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 07 Mar 2019, 05:11 
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I remember when VCD was like that. If Bluray became like VCD...holy cow...

...we might finally get a complete Looney Toons collection...
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 07 Mar 2019, 08:15 
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2024 - mark your calenders, the year physical media is banned by the UN for its use of plastics. Also the year most of the world ignores the UN as usual.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 07 Mar 2019, 15:54 
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I was also reading the title of this topic again.

Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good

I think we will go outside and enjoy the world or find a good clean hobby that we can enjoy
like playing golf in random parks as forper does :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 07 Mar 2019, 21:32 
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rein-o wrote:
I think we will go outside and enjoy the world or find a good clean hobby that we can enjoy
like playing golf in random parks as forper does :lol:


Try it, the green fees are really reasonable. Look forward to a lot of golden moments, like when a junkie walking his dog offers you advice on your swing. Or a crow flies away with your ball. It's the greatest scenery/arthouse LD ever made, in analogue Super MUSE EYE Vision.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 08 Mar 2019, 00:06 
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I like how we have golf carts because the greens are really too big to walk though in the early days of humanity we did walk probably that much and more in a single day.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 08 Mar 2019, 00:47 
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forper wrote:
rein-o wrote:
I think we will go outside and enjoy the world or find a good clean hobby that we can enjoy
like playing golf in random parks as forper does :lol:


Try it, the green fees are really reasonable. Look forward to a lot of golden moments, like when a junkie walking his dog offers you advice on your swing. Or a crow flies away with your ball. It's the greatest scenery/arthouse LD ever made, in analogue Super MUSE EYE Vision.

Oh I'm so going to do this, when I visit NYC.
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 08 Mar 2019, 09:51 
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Cool, post pics here if you play

we can start the international LGGA (Laserdisc Ghetto Golf Association)
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 Post subject: Re: Alternatives for physical media when it’s dead for good
PostPosted: 08 Mar 2019, 15:53 
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forper wrote:
Cool, post pics here if you play

we can start the international LGGA (Laserdisc Ghetto Golf Association)

I'd rather it be the CGGA. Cheap Ghetto Golf Association :lol:
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