|
It is currently 26 Apr 2024, 15:08
|
View unsolved topics | View unanswered posts
|
|
|
|
Author |
Message |
foxpup
|
Post subject: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 25 Mar 2023, 18:46 |
Third post and above |
|
|
Joined: 08 Sep 2020, 12:35 Posts: 4 Location: United States Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 1 time
|
In my searching about for good thing in the Laserdisc market I came upon this combination of items on ebay. https://www.ebay.com/itm/304191203579https://www.ebay.com/itm/385498908739They are both titled "Father Christmas" and the covers are clearly NOT the same even though the readable reference ID's are the same. The provided pictures of the items for sale were good enough that they could both be clearly read. ASLA-1027 The database only has entry for one such disc. Father Christmas (1991) [ASLA-1027]So speaking as a collector, have we got a need for a new entry in the database or should I regard both of these as the same thing?...but they aren't if you care about the covers. I believe something similar may have happened with the related video "The Snowman". Thoughts anyone?
Attachments: |
Father Christmas LD 2.jpg [ 306.59 KiB | Viewed 1781 times ]
|
Father Christmas LD 1.jpg [ 432.66 KiB | Viewed 1781 times ]
|
|
|
|
|
|
drecksoft
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 25 Mar 2023, 21:43 |
Honest fan |
|
|
Joined: 13 Oct 2018, 12:06 Posts: 75 Location: Germany Has thanked: 4 times Been thanked: 10 times
|
That's not so uncommon. Werner - Beinhart! (1990) [51397]The first comment says, there is a second cover version. That's correct, I do have both. And this is not the only one.
|
|
|
|
|
foxpup
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 25 Mar 2023, 22:08 |
Third post and above |
|
|
Joined: 08 Sep 2020, 12:35 Posts: 4 Location: United States Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 1 time
|
drecksoft wrote: That's not so uncommon. Werner - Beinhart! (1990) [51397]The first comment says, there is a second cover version. That's correct, I do have both. And this is not the only one. First, thanx for your response. So how do people deal with the matter? Doesn't that mean that there are lots of discs out there that the database doesn't/can't acknowledge? Am I just wrong? Is there a system for dealing with that? Sometimes my "completeness monster" shows itself and news like this disturbs it to the core since that means no-one actually knows if they've got a complete set of anything. If I may ask, how do you cope with the matter? Hopefully it's just no biggie for you but I thought I'd ask. LLAP
|
|
|
|
|
atsampson
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 00:24 |
Genuinely interested |
|
|
Joined: 08 Feb 2007, 17:24 Posts: 35 Location: Scotland Has thanked: 8 times Been thanked: 5 times
|
Criterion's releases of Taxi Driver are another example of this: there are two versions of CC1219L, and three versions of CC1218L. (And there are probably plenty of examples where two publishers happened to choose the same numbering scheme, e.g. 10004 and 10004.)
|
|
|
|
|
admin
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 05:37 |
Site Admin |
|
|
Joined: 07 Aug 2002, 23:37 Posts: 4551 Location: Tokyo Has thanked: 295 times Been thanked: 1147 times
|
Happened a LOT. Usually cover design needed to be updated for additional UPC, change of publishing rights (companies merging, contracts expiring), change of style (VHS-size vs. full covers, different artists), price update, Digital Audio remaster, inclusion in a new series, etc. Cover update: Above the Law (1988) [1178613] vs Above the Law (1988) [1178613] Gene Shalit's Critics Choice ( double combo! VHS to full + change of collection): Double Indemnity (1944) [21004]Invisible Man, The (1933) [23007]Touch of Evil (1958) (Uncut) [21010]Encore Edition: Double Indemnity (1944) [21004]Invisible Man, The (1933) [23007]Touch of Evil (1958) (Uncut) [21010]Sometimes they would update the catalog number, sometimes not. Julien
_________________ HARDWARE DATABASE HLD-X0/9 LD-S9 OPPO 105/205 SL-1200G LDD-1 MSC-4000 R2144 PONTUS II C45 MC257
|
|
|
|
|
foxpup
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 07:48 |
Third post and above |
|
|
Joined: 08 Sep 2020, 12:35 Posts: 4 Location: United States Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 1 time
|
So the knowledge I should take from this conversation is that a multitude of laserdiscs are out there with different cover art but that if they have the same reference ID I can be confident that at least the disc has the same content, at least if the title is the same? Also that lddb.com CAN accomodate multiple instances of the same reference ID's becuase the database uses a different unique identifier for each recognized disc type. https://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/24353/11 ... ve-the-Lawhttps://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/59003/11 ... ve-the-LawIn this case the identifiers seem to be 24353 and 59003 whch I guess are incremental numbers handed out as people discover new discs. I suppose since neither of the two "Father Christmas" discs are in my hands I should not attempt to generate a new item until I do so. Also, I should be encouraged to do so for any discs that I do have that may not be represented as shown in the database even if it is only a cover difference. Please correct me if these are NOT the set of ideas I should finish with. Thank you, everyone for clearing this up for me.
|
|
|
|
|
takeshi666
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 12:14 |
Absolute fan |
|
|
Joined: 01 Feb 2018, 02:41 Posts: 1995 Location: Finland Has thanked: 183 times Been thanked: 386 times
|
rein-o wrote: Looks like someone needs to add this and explain that there is a different cover in the comments unless you can get a good image of that other cover and send it to the admin. I guess that would probably have to be me since I've got that green variant cover.
|
|
|
|
|
signofzeta
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 14:33 |
Jedi Knight |
|
|
Joined: 14 Jan 2010, 09:44 Posts: 5988 Location: Ann Arbor Has thanked: 1292 times Been thanked: 1106 times
|
foxpup wrote: So the knowledge I should take from this conversation is that a multitude of laserdiscs are out there with different cover art but that if they have the same reference ID I can be confident that at least the disc has the same content, at least if the title is the same? Also that lddb.com CAN accomodate multiple instances of the same reference ID's becuase the database uses a different unique identifier for each recognized disc type. https://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/24353/11 ... ve-the-Lawhttps://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/59003/11 ... ve-the-LawIn this case the identifiers seem to be 24353 and 59003 whch I guess are incremental numbers handed out as people discover new discs. I suppose since neither of the two "Father Christmas" discs are in my hands I should not attempt to generate a new item until I do so. Also, I should be encouraged to do so for any discs that I do have that may not be represented as shown in the database even if it is only a cover difference. Please correct me if these are NOT the set of ideas I should finish with. Thank you, everyone for clearing this up for me. What you should be taking away from this is that you care way too much about completeness and correctness. The people who MADE THIS STUFF didn’t even care as much as you do. This ain’t like Star Wars toys or Yugioh cards where every single thing came from the same company at the same time and is all fully accounted for with ease. “Collect them all.” is a thing that can be done if you’re rich enough and if it’s designed to be done by the people who made it all. Tens of thousands of LDs came from hundreds of plants and publishers in a dozen countries over a period of decades. You cannot…”know it”, ever. Not even with LDDB. Covers change while catalog items retain the same number…not just LDs. Books, records, tapes, model kits, toothpaste, pretty much everything that stays in manufacture long enough. You change the number when it matters and is helpful, not to soothe mental illness. The idea of a “complete collection” in LD is…much newer than LD…a childish idea, wildly impractical to attempt and totally impossible to achieve. You’re going to have to punch out once in a while and relax. BTW, I have the Father Xmas with the obi. Let me know if you have any questions about it. There at least two actually different LDs of The Snowman. One has the Bowie intro and one doesn’t. There may be more but those also may just be reprints of the same thing.
_________________ All about LD care, inner sleeves, shrink wrap, etc.
https://youtu.be/b3O-vHpHRpM
|
|
|
|
|
rein-o
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 16:24 |
Jedi Master |
|
|
Joined: 03 May 2004, 19:05 Posts: 8106 Location: Dullaware Has thanked: 1219 times Been thanked: 844 times
|
takeshi666 wrote: rein-o wrote: Looks like someone needs to add this and explain that there is a different cover in the comments unless you can get a good image of that other cover and send it to the admin. I guess that would probably have to be me since I've got that green variant cover. I really meant for the OP to do it so they can help by adding the title.
|
|
|
|
|
foxpup
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 26 Mar 2023, 22:08 |
Third post and above |
|
|
Joined: 08 Sep 2020, 12:35 Posts: 4 Location: United States Has thanked: 14 times Been thanked: 1 time
|
signofzeta wrote: foxpup wrote: So the knowledge I should take from this conversation is that a multitude of laserdiscs are out there with different cover art but that if they have the same reference ID I can be confident that at least the disc has the same content, at least if the title is the same? Also that lddb.com CAN accomodate multiple instances of the same reference ID's becuase the database uses a different unique identifier for each recognized disc type. https://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/24353/11 ... ve-the-Lawhttps://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/59003/11 ... ve-the-LawIn this case the identifiers seem to be 24353 and 59003 whch I guess are incremental numbers handed out as people discover new discs. I suppose since neither of the two "Father Christmas" discs are in my hands I should not attempt to generate a new item until I do so. Also, I should be encouraged to do so for any discs that I do have that may not be represented as shown in the database even if it is only a cover difference. Please correct me if these are NOT the set of ideas I should finish with. Thank you, everyone for clearing this up for me. What you should be taking away from this is that you care way too much about completeness and correctness. The people who MADE THIS STUFF didn’t even care as much as you do. This ain’t like Star Wars toys or Yugioh cards where every single thing came from the same company at the same time and is all fully accounted for with ease. “Collect them all.” is a thing that can be done if you’re rich enough and if it’s designed to be done by the people who made it all. Tens of thousands of LDs came from hundreds of plants and publishers in a dozen countries over a period of decades. You cannot…”know it”, ever. Not even with LDDB. Covers change while catalog items retain the same number…not just LDs. Books, records, tapes, model kits, toothpaste, pretty much everything that stays in manufacture long enough. You change the number when it matters and is helpful, not to soothe mental illness. The idea of a “complete collection” in LD is…much newer than LD…a childish idea, wildly impractical to attempt and totally impossible to achieve. You’re going to have to punch out once in a while and relax. BTW, I have the Father Xmas with the obi. Let me know if you have any questions about it. There at least two actually different LDs of The Snowman. One has the Bowie intro and one doesn’t. There may be more but those also may just be reprints of the same thing. I really like this practical perspective. Besides, if complete-ism gets the better part of me it ruins the fun and enjoying ourselves is what collecting laserdiscs is all about, right? I'll just have to beat down that OCD demon from time to time so I can continue enjoying things. "Just repeat to yourself, "It's just a show, I should really just relax For Mystery Science Theater 3000!" " Thanx and LLAP
|
|
|
|
|
drecksoft
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 27 Mar 2023, 20:59 |
Honest fan |
|
|
Joined: 13 Oct 2018, 12:06 Posts: 75 Location: Germany Has thanked: 4 times Been thanked: 10 times
|
There are even worse things: Same cover, same catalog number but one version in full screen, one in widescreen. So different content here. The ONLY difference is a sticker on the later one. Lethal Weapon (1987) [11709 LD]Or here where there are two covers but to know if you have the "fixed" version of the disc, you have to look at the mint marks. Eagles: Hell Freezes Over (1994) [ID4065GF]
|
|
|
|
|
blam1
|
Post subject: Re: Two DIFFERENT laserdiscs with the SAME reference ID Posted: 02 Apr 2023, 18:42 |
Advanced fan |
|
|
Joined: 21 Dec 2002, 18:44 Posts: 959 Has thanked: 0 time Been thanked: 122 times
|
admin wrote: Happened a LOT. Usually cover design needed to be updated for additional UPC, change of publishing rights (companies merging, contracts expiring), change of style (VHS-size vs. full covers, different artists), price update, Digital Audio remaster, inclusion in a new series, etc. Cover update: Above the Law (1988) [1178613] vs Above the Law (1988) [1178613] Gene Shalit's Critics Choice ( double combo! VHS to full + change of collection): Double Indemnity (1944) [21004]Invisible Man, The (1933) [23007]Touch of Evil (1958) (Uncut) [21010]Encore Edition: Double Indemnity (1944) [21004]Invisible Man, The (1933) [23007]Touch of Evil (1958) (Uncut) [21010]Sometimes they would update the catalog number, sometimes not. Julien Universal reused catalog numbers - notice these are still using the "Discovision" style numbers. When Universal started issuing ISBN numbers, they were forced to switch to the 4xxxx series. For the "Gene Shalit" titles, when the contract ended, all the titles were reissued, same catalog number and discs, with updated Jackets. Image Entertainment constantly changed jackets for repressings. VHS style artwork in the middle of the jacket, then moved to the left edge, then replaced with full jacket art. Sometimes with the banner across the top edge and sometimes not. Of course, then there are the repressings Image did where they changed the masters, but not the jackets (Sound of Music, Star Wars Technidisc repressings).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum
|
|