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 Post subject: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 08 Feb 2013, 05:02 
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Lately I've been coming across alot of LDs that MAY have been made by PRINCO. For example a title will already have Pioneer Japan in the database as the manufacturer, but no mint marks. When I begin to enter them in sometimes PRINCO will come up as a possible manufactuer. I have even had cases where the mint marks for side 1 indicate Pioneer Japan, and the mint marks for side 2 indicate PRINCO.

FROM PRINCO'S WEBSITE:
*1992 Laser Disc (LD) Mastering begins to supply stampers for LD production. The Laser Disc Division begins mass production of its LD.

However it's doubtful PRINCO made all of these discs. My theory is that one possible explanation is that PRINCO made stamper discs that were sent to other manufacturers for replication. But then again, my understanding is that stampers rarely left the facility that made them. Who makes the stamper can be of critical importance. For example:

1776: Special Edition (1972) [PSE92-23]
Pioneer Special Editions
Made by Pioneer USA

1776 (1972) (Uncut) [08526]
Columbia/TriStar Home Video
Made by DADC USA

Both releases used the same video master, although it is obvious that the stamper discs were of different origin. For starters they have different side change points. Also the release by Columbia/TriStar has considerable gatefloat during the opening titles, where as the Pioneer release doesn't to nearly the same degree. The Pioneer release looks sharper, and has a richer Stereo sound.

PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question. ;)

STAY AWESOME! :)
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 Post subject: Re: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 08 Feb 2013, 23:42 
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cessnaace wrote:
Lately I've been coming across alot of LDs that MAY have been made by PRINCO. For example a title will already have Pioneer Japan in the database as the manufacturer, but no mint marks. When I begin to enter them in sometimes PRINCO will come up as a possible manufactuer. I have even had cases where the mint marks for side 1 indicate Pioneer Japan, and the mint marks for side 2 indicate PRINCO.

FROM PRINCO'S WEBSITE:
*1992 Laser Disc (LD) Mastering begins to supply stampers for LD production. The Laser Disc Division begins mass production of its LD.

However it's doubtful PRINCO made all of these discs. My theory is that one possible explanation is that PRINCO made stamper discs that were sent to other manufacturers for replication. But then again, my understanding is that stampers rarely left the facility that made them. Who makes the stamper can be of critical importance. For example:

1776: Special Edition (1972) [PSE92-23]
Pioneer Special Editions
Made by Pioneer USA

1776 (1972) (Uncut) [08526]
Columbia/TriStar Home Video
Made by DADC USA

Both releases used the same video master, although it is obvious that the stamper discs were of different origin. For starters they have different side change points. Also the release by Columbia/TriStar has considerable gatefloat during the opening titles, where as the Pioneer release doesn't to nearly the same degree. The Pioneer release looks sharper, and has a richer Stereo sound.

PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question. ;)

STAY AWESOME! :)


Hi Mark,

Since I was the one who discovered the existence of the PRINCO manufacturing plant, I suppose that makes me the resident expert here on their products. Let me start by saying that almost all of the discs I have encountered which were made there are either Taiwanese or Hong Kong releases. I have only found two to date which are U.S. releases made there. Both of these are karaoke titles from the publisher Tip Top Entertainment. One of them is the title "DJ Party Mix" (TED-016), which I just acquired about a week ago. Julien hasn't had time to process the update I submitted about it, but it even states "MADE IN TAIWAN" on the disc label on the "dead side". This is the first such example I have found like that.

I'll try to summarize what I have figured out about the PRINCO mint markings. All of the early ones I came across were Hong Kong releases. The mint markings on them all had batch numbers which began with the prefix "KA" on side one, and "KB" on side two, followed by a series of digits. These were sometimes followed by a suffix of 1 or 2 letters, which were sometimes preceded by a hyphen. The serial numbers on these began with "A" on side one, and "B" on side two, again followed by a series of digits. The first 3 or 4 digits of each serial number seemed to match the first 3 or 4 digits in the batch number on that side. The mint markings on the Taiwanese releases which I encountered later looked just the same as the Hong Kong ones, but the batch numbers didn't have the "KA" and "KB" prefixes. Instead, they began with simply "A" on side one, and "B" on side two. These were followed by a series of digits like those on the Hong Kong releases, again sometimes with a 1 or 2 letter suffix, with or without hyphen. The other key difference on these was that, unlike the Hong Kong releases, the Taiwanese ones did not have any serial numbers at all.

I did my best to explain all of this to Julien, and he tried to adjust the Mint-O-Matic to detect these mint markings. At first, it was only detecting a few of them, and missing many more of them. When I told him about this, he made another adjustment which made a dramatic improvement in the number of them which the Mint-O-Matic correctly detected and flagged as PRINCO-made discs. It is likely that Julien may have to make another slight "tweak" to somehow differentiate the PRINCO mint marks from those of Pioneer Japan. In fact, when I first sent pictures of the PRINCO mint markings to Julien a long time ago, he thought that they might have been some sort of Pioneer markings. He had never seen any like them before, and thought that they looked more like Pioneer than any other known mint markings. As it turned out, about a month ago, I acquired a disc which led to the discovery of this previously unknown manufacturing plant. It was a Taiwanese release of the film "Heaven's Prisoners". The crucial clue which this disc bore was a mint marking on the "dead side" which simply read "PRINCO".

Probably the best advice I could give in response to your question is that if you have a disc which the Mint-O-Matic flags as PRINCO-made, if it is a U.S. or Japanese release, I think it is HIGHLY UNLIKELY that it was made by PRINCO. I hope that this information helps.

David :)
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 Post subject: Re: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 10 Feb 2013, 22:15 
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laserking wrote:
cessnaace wrote:
Lately I've been coming across alot of LDs that MAY have been made by PRINCO. For example a title will already have Pioneer Japan in the database as the manufacturer, but no mint marks. When I begin to enter them in sometimes PRINCO will come up as a possible manufactuer. I have even had cases where the mint marks for side 1 indicate Pioneer Japan, and the mint marks for side 2 indicate PRINCO.

FROM PRINCO'S WEBSITE:
*1992 Laser Disc (LD) Mastering begins to supply stampers for LD production. The Laser Disc Division begins mass production of its LD.

However it's doubtful PRINCO made all of these discs. My theory is that one possible explanation is that PRINCO made stamper discs that were sent to other manufacturers for replication. But then again, my understanding is that stampers rarely left the facility that made them. Who makes the stamper can be of critical importance. For example:

1776: Special Edition (1972) [PSE92-23]
Pioneer Special Editions
Made by Pioneer USA

1776 (1972) (Uncut) [08526]
Columbia/TriStar Home Video
Made by DADC USA

Both releases used the same video master, although it is obvious that the stamper discs were of different origin. For starters they have different side change points. Also the release by Columbia/TriStar has considerable gatefloat during the opening titles, where as the Pioneer release doesn't to nearly the same degree. The Pioneer release looks sharper, and has a richer Stereo sound.

PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question. ;)

STAY AWESOME! :)


Hi Mark,

Since I was the one who discovered the existence of the PRINCO manufacturing plant, I suppose that makes me the resident expert here on their products. Let me start by saying that almost all of the discs I have encountered which were made there are either Taiwanese or Hong Kong releases. I have only found two to date which are U.S. releases made there. Both of these are karaoke titles from the publisher Tip Top Entertainment. One of them is the title "DJ Party Mix" (TED-016), which I just acquired about a week ago. Julien hasn't had time to process the update I submitted about it, but it even states "MADE IN TAIWAN" on the disc label on the "dead side". This is the first such example I have found like that.

I'll try to summarize what I have figured out about the PRINCO mint markings. All of the early ones I came across were Hong Kong releases. The mint markings on them all had batch numbers which began with the prefix "KA" on side one, and "KB" on side two, followed by a series of digits. These were sometimes followed by a suffix of 1 or 2 letters, which were sometimes preceded by a hyphen. The serial numbers on these began with "A" on side one, and "B" on side two, again followed by a series of digits. The first 3 or 4 digits of each serial number seemed to match the first 3 or 4 digits in the batch number on that side. The mint markings on the Taiwanese releases which I encountered later looked just the same as the Hong Kong ones, but the batch numbers didn't have the "KA" and "KB" prefixes. Instead, they began with simply "A" on side one, and "B" on side two. These were followed by a series of digits like those on the Hong Kong releases, again sometimes with a 1 or 2 letter suffix, with or without hyphen. The other key difference on these was that, unlike the Hong Kong releases, the Taiwanese ones did not have any serial numbers at all.

I did my best to explain all of this to Julien, and he tried to adjust the Mint-O-Matic to detect these mint markings. At first, it was only detecting a few of them, and missing many more of them. When I told him about this, he made another adjustment which made a dramatic improvement in the number of them which the Mint-O-Matic correctly detected and flagged as PRINCO-made discs. It is likely that Julien may have to make another slight "tweak" to somehow differentiate the PRINCO mint marks from those of Pioneer Japan. In fact, when I first sent pictures of the PRINCO mint markings to Julien a long time ago, he thought that they might have been some sort of Pioneer markings. He had never seen any like them before, and thought that they looked more like Pioneer than any other known mint markings. As it turned out, about a month ago, I acquired a disc which led to the discovery of this previously unknown manufacturing plant. It was a Taiwanese release of the film "Heaven's Prisoners". The crucial clue which this disc bore was a mint marking on the "dead side" which simply read "PRINCO".

Probably the best advice I could give in response to your question is that if you have a disc which the Mint-O-Matic flags as PRINCO-made, if it is a U.S. or Japanese release, I think it is HIGHLY UNLIKELY that it was made by PRINCO. I hope that this information helps.

David :)


David,

It all makes sense now. Thanks!

STAY AWESOME! :)

Mark
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 Post subject: Re: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 06:31 
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laserking wrote:
Probably the best advice I could give in response to your question is that if you have a disc which the Mint-O-Matic flags as PRINCO-made, if it is a U.S. or Japanese release, I think it is HIGHLY UNLIKELY that it was made by PRINCO. I hope that this information helps.


This is correct!

Sorry about the fact that I haven't found the time to fine-tune the Mint-o-Matic script. Things will get better for me during March and I should resume fixing/improving/clarifying LDDb features soon.

Julien
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 Post subject: Re: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 28 Feb 2013, 22:55 
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admin wrote:
laserking wrote:
Probably the best advice I could give in response to your question is that if you have a disc which the Mint-O-Matic flags as PRINCO-made, if it is a U.S. or Japanese release, I think it is HIGHLY UNLIKELY that it was made by PRINCO. I hope that this information helps.


This is correct!

Sorry about the fact that I haven't found the time to fine-tune the Mint-o-Matic script. Things will get better for me during March and I should resume fixing/improving/clarifying LDDb features soon.

Julien


Julien,

That's ok. I understand. It's just that I hadn't heard of PRINCO before.

STAY AWESOME! :)

Mark
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 Post subject: Re: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 14 Jun 2021, 22:39 
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I was wondering if this disc I added recently: Run Away (1984) [LC03]
might be a Princo manufacture. It has no markings apart from the ring of dashes in the PDO/Sonopress style, but the plastic wrapping it came in has a "MADE IN TAIWAN ROC" sticker on it. It was suggested in THIS thread that those two signs together might indicate Princo.
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 Post subject: Re: PRINCO or not PRINCO. That is indeed the question.
PostPosted: 15 Jun 2021, 07:20 
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yukabacera wrote:
I was wondering if this disc I added recently: Run Away (1984) [LC03]
might be a Princo manufacture. It has no markings apart from the ring of dashes in the PDO/Sonopress style, but the plastic wrapping it came in has a "MADE IN TAIWAN ROC" sticker on it. It was suggested in THIS thread that those two signs together might indicate Princo.


As specified in the other thread I have an Indonesian Karaoke disc that looks like a PDO UK but has the Made in Taiwan ROC stick on the plastic wrapping
it came in. From what I understand my dear friend Laserking believes that these discs were made by PDO in the UK but I am convinced that these discs were manufactured
by a different obscure pressing plant in Taiwan. I also do not see any reason why these discs were pressed by PRINCO. PRINCO discs look different.
It is possible that PRINCO manufactured these discs, too, but why two different designs, one with mint marks and the other one looking like your typical
PDO disc without mint marks ?

Perhaps we will never find out who really produced these discs.
Btw the disc that I have shows some considerable rot on one of the two sides ( the other side is fine ) but at least the audio is still there.
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