Yes, you are correct in saying it is subjective. Just like you can say dirt tastes better than birthday cake, you can say that a cropped DD DVD is better than a WS DTS LaserDisc or a LaserDisc is better than a native HD Blu-ray. You aren't wrong. You're just being ridiculous.


Also, I'm sorry for sidetracking the conversation, but what does "the laser image has more character a greater represents" mean?

You could possibly say dirt tastes better than birthday cake on a pastries or gardening forum and that may rise to an "interesting" discussion . That definitely would involve personal opinion (subjectivity). On the laserdisc data base forum we discuss laserdisc and other audio/video components. So here, we regularly discuss subjectivity as it applies to those things.

What really would be ridiculous, would be equating a discussion on personal preference between blu ray, dvd, laserdisc, dts, dolby digital, etc. with birthday cakes and dirt. You made a very good point though, both analogies involve choosing what you like regardless of how "bad" one thing is perceived to be over another. Whether it be desired intent to challenge simplicity or just pure over-intellectualizing, CONTEXT is an area that displays weakness in your debates.

Sorry, that was supposed to read "laser image has more character AND greater represents..." I was writing that post on my iPhone and must have done an autocorrect.

I think you're being very self-righteous. People have different tastes whether you understand them or not.

If you're a worm you would choose dirt over cake.

Sorry, I was more wondering about what you meant by "has character."

I understand your tastes or at least I assume I do. My point, simply put (though I guess it might not be so simple), is that I believe that the premise this discussion is based on (Is technically better vs. personal pref. hard to comprehend?) is faulty, because LaserDisc is not always technically worse than DVD and vice versa. If you disregard science than we have no standard to compare what one another considers an improvement and the whole discussion becomes pointless. For example, when a newbie comes on the forum and asks what to get if he wants a "better" player, what do I tell him if we don't assume standards? I'd have to interrogate the guy as to his preferences each and every time.

Also, people aren't worms.

naiaru
Well first of all, no, I don't think the LDDB was formed so that people who are so disappointed with LaserDisc PQ that they disregard any tangible benefit it may have and state that they like it purely because they think the format is nifty can complain about science. I could be wrong. Admittedly, I've never asked the admin about it.

Secondly, what context do you want? The situation surrounding the dirt and birthday cake? I wrote it assuming that the theoretical cake and dirt were just ordinary dirt and birthday cake.

Also, the analogy was just an analogy.

I really have to say, Blu Ray is gorgeous, and if you prefer the look of LD, you're f***ing retarded. saying you prefer how LD looks over BD or DVD is like going to the eye doctor and saying "hey doc, give me the weakest prescription you got, I'm just not a big fan of seeing things clearly!"

Bash this guy if you want but he is correct.
Remington just will not let this go it seems...

Just got another Laserdisc in the post; man I love those big shiny things

Happy to elaborate. I feel that often there is as much value in the flaws of an image as there is in the image itself. By character I mean I'm not watching something that looks like just a video game. Seeing some film artifacts or the like enhances the viewing experience for me as it more closely resembles what I grew up watching in the cinema.

I understand where you're coming from with the players, but my argument still works for that too. With a player you could definitively say that this one has a higher S/N ratio to that one. But as soon as you grade it you then personalise it and give it a subjective quality. I think one of the cool things about laserdisc is that your image is as dependant on the player as it is the media. In that way you can (if you have the money or access) find the perfect player that suits your visual and aural sensabilities.

People are worms and bugs and dogs and cows... well that is if you follow Buddhism.

I don't see laserdisc fans "disregarding any tangible benefit" that laserdisc has, nor do the majority seem to be collecting lds because they are "nifty". Preferring laserdisc over technically improved units like dvd and blu ray does not mean the laserdisc lover has no basis for his love of it.. But keep in mind he is allowed to love it no matter what, and that's when we enter the world of subjectivity. As an aside, the higher percentage of laserdisc fans on this site and others often discuss the technical attributes of ld. So, it is clearly preferred with purpose and reason.

Science is a word that many have used to support the fact that other components such as blu ray and dvd are more advanced than laserdisc. I chose the words "technically better" for the topic but eventually settled on using the word science in my conversations because it is often repeated by you (and others).

The real shock is that someone who "knows better" because of technical facts, would attempt to tell another that what hits his eyes and ears is, according to your birthday cake-dirt analogy, ridiculous. You can throw my whole "context' issue out the window if you want and you still end up with a flawed analogy as it relates to subjectivity. (EDITED due to some grammer mistakes)

Oh, goodie. Idealogical purity tests. This whole thread makes me want to take my tinfoil hat & go home.

If for you the best way to tell others how you feel about laserdisc on a laserdisc forum is to support a member that links a preference for laserdisc over blu ray to being a mentally handicapped individual, you've taken a big leap towards exposure. Yeah, you love laserdisc.

ohreally
So by your line of thinking just because I own Blu-rays I CANT own and love Laserdisc(s)?!
You are not the home theatre police

naiaru
You ARE disregarding any tangible benefit LaserDisc may have. LOOK AT THE TITLE OF THIS THREAD FOR GOD'S SAKE. You literally say LaserDisc isn't technically better. I'm not saying you're wrong for liking a movie on LaserDisc over the version on Blu-ray a reasonable person would call "better." I'm saying it isn't all or nothing. If you were being rational, you'd look at each movie individually and asses which version is best on a case by case basis. Instead you go "yeah, LaserDisc sucks, but I like it!"

On a side note, I literally quoted Merriam Webster as to the definition of science. If you guys are taking issue with that, that seems to me more like an issue with Merriam Webster than with me.

If for you the best way to tell others how you feel about laserdisc on a laserdisc forum is to support a member that links a preference for laserdisc over blu ray to being a mentally handicapped individual, you've taken a big leap towards exposure. Yeah, you love laserdisc.

Reading my posts is important. Time and again I've written to you that SOME ARE CLAMING that scientific facts make laserdisc the "weaker" technology, hence the basis for thread title. I well know the merits of ld. I've also said sometimes I watch dvds (because the ld could be that bad). There are always variables . Some people (if you read the posts) like artifacts, grain and uncompressed sound of laserdisc no matter if you "proved" other formats were better. Thats as close to "all or nothing" as you can get.

Don't tell me I said " laserdisc sucks but I like it". If you have interpreted it wrong I can't help you. Several other members are not having an interpretation problem. Take your own advise , look up subjective in Merriam/Websters.

It's not as simple as LD > DVD or DVD > LD. There are cases where DVD is superior or LaserDisc and cases where the opposite is true. All the things I listed before are scientifically probable facts.
DVDs do use Macroblocks for compression and Macroblocks are the cause of Macroblocking. Lossless 16-bit@44.1kHz PCM tracks are technically superior to 448 kbit/s DD tracks. Poor comb filters are often used on composite masters for DVD authoring. The choice of LaserDisc over DVD can be scientific in some cases. It's not all a matter of feelings.

No, it's about feelings, otherwise there wouldn't be a laserdisc database. Outside of Betamax, laserdisc has some of the most passionate individuals in the electronics realm. And, they maintain those feelings even in the wake of hi def. Maybe some others will chime in.