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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 24 Apr 2019, 17:38 
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forper wrote:
segasonic91 wrote:
Although I don't need subs anymore,


Real envious of you. Despite university classes, a year studying in Japan and 5 years working there I still can only understand 20% of what's being said. Anyway last year I resolved to relearn it. After 6 months of restudying JLPT N4 daily I think some of it is sinking in, but it's so slow. I was never good at language and now I'm older it's even harder but I'll never give up.

What JLPT level do you think you have in vocab? Any study tips? Thanks.


Well, I think I have lost a lof in the past 5 years. I remember watching Maison Ikkoku on DVD from start to finish back then and understanding 99% of it. I think I would lose a bit now. Also, I am terrible with technical stuff. Something like Legend of the Galactic Heroes is reaaally difficult. I felt really overwhelmed watching it until an episode a few eps in where there was a return visit to a family home. THAT was the first episode I fully understood! War and political stuff is so over my head. Yakuza stuff is hard too, or "manly men speak". I have played the entire Ryu ga Gotoku series from PS2 through to the PS4 but always struggled at times.

I remember I bought the first game when I was at uni there in 2006 and one of my best friends was watching me play and even SHE had trouble understanding some stuff. She is Japanese so that says it all. She was the typical type of Japanese person that thinks anyone who likes anime and games is "weird otaku". I ended taking her to Akihabara and she loved it, lol. I was happy to educate her that "anime lover" does not mean weird and creepy as they are always potrayed in Japan. It is no different to her watching American crap. Densha Otoko had aired around that time and she said it changed a lot of people's attitude over there.

As for study tips, for "tangou", I always found that making up a way to remember words worked really well. Same with kanji. I also spoke keigou which is just like another damn language. Repetition is only good to a point, but if you have a way to remember words, I guarantee you will never forget them. Practise is really the only other way.

When I started, I already knew katakana as I had taught myself with my Saturn Fan books and also use to watch a kids school programme on SBS. Hiragana I also knew, but not as well as katakana. To get it into me head, instead of just writing things over and over, I used to use romanji lyrics of Hamasaki Ayumi songs and also some Utada Hikaru. That worked really well. They are also the songs to this day that I still remember off by heart as well! I know ALL Ayu's songs off by heart, but those songs I used to write out, I remember every word by heart to this day. She was my absolute favourite singer ever. Seeing her live in 2006 was amazing. Also got to see Hikki as well and was 10 rows from the stage. Wish I had seats like that for Ayu :(
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 02:10 
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Thanks so much for your reply. Some good tips!

segasonic91 wrote:
I remember watching Maison Ikkoku on DVD from start to finish back then and understanding 99% of it. I think I would lose a bit now. Also, I am terrible with technical stuff. Something like Legend of the Galactic Heroes is reaaally difficult. I felt really overwhelmed watching it until an episode a few eps in where there was a return visit to a family home. THAT was the first episode I fully understood! War and political stuff is so over my head. Yakuza stuff is hard too, or "manly men speak". I have played the entire Ryu ga Gotoku series from PS2 through to the PS4 but always struggled at times.


I feel the same. Young women are so much easier to understand. I also watched MI start to finish and well worth it. What a great show.

My problem is my real goal is to watch gritty SF war real robot stuff from the '80s which is full of crazy vocab, old men and tough guys! I'm trying to learn JLPT at the same time as a bunch of SF/political/war vocab. I'm building a separate list of that vocab myself using Quizlet as I watch shows and pick it up. But when the oyajis and yankees in the shows say it, it's slurred and inflected so much, often with different endings it's so hard to catch.

The next show I watch raw will either be Dirty Pair of Orguss (Just got the box set for this, been hunting it for years even though it's not rare every time I was ready to buy one had just sold, the box is so beautiful) , both should be less of a learning curve than say Votoms or Zeta Gundam.

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As for study tips, for "tangou", I always found that making up a way to remember words worked really well. Same with kanji. I also spoke keigou which is just like another damn language. Repetition is only good to a point, but if you have a way to remember words, I guarantee you will never forget them. Practise is really the only other way.


Yeah I've been thinking of matching words with pictures instead of translations? Maybe an image in my head would work better.

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When I started, I already knew katakana as I had taught myself with my Saturn Fan books and also use to watch a kids school programme on SBS. Hiragana I also knew, but not as well as katakana. To get it into me head, instead of just writing things over and over, I used to use romanji lyrics of Hamasaki Ayumi songs and also some Utada Hikaru. That worked really well. They are also the songs to this day that I still remember off by heart as well!


My hiragana and katakana is solid but writing out lyrics to get the sounds seems like a good idea! I might take that to a mecha anime scene, write down the dialogue then play back with subs, see how close I get.

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I know ALL Ayu's songs off by heart, but those songs I used to write out, I remember every word by heart to this day. She was my absolute favourite singer ever. Seeing her live in 2006 was amazing. Also got to see Hikki as well and was 10 rows from the stage. Wish I had seats like that for Ayu :(


Pretty jealous, I never saw a Jpop show. From my DVDs Ayu shows seem pretty incredible,

In Utada's Bohmemian Summer 2000 DVD she seems like a really weak live performer. It could be the production though?

Who was better in real life?
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 10:53 
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Ayu's shows are always amazing! The Miss(un)derstood tour was great. I am still pissed she didn't sing SURREAL on that tour, first tour she dropped it and it is my favourite song! The live version is always awesome!! I desperately wanted to go to the Countdown Live 2006 show but it waa impossible. The day for public ticket sales came and I was at the local convini first thing. 2 seconds, litterally, past 10am it said SOLD OUT.

You are right about Utada Hikaru. She is no Ayu when it comes to live performance. She just kind of stands there and doesn't do much. The crowd was boring as hell as well. Even for Japan! The 2006 DVD was my show in Saitama. Well, it is a mixture of my show and the second show in Saitama. It was her last tour before she "retired" though, so I am really glad I got to see her. Damn shame I wasn't in Tokyo so I could see L'arc en Ciel for their Tokyo Dome anniversary shows! Love them and HYDE's solo stuff.

Oh and Maison Ikkoku.... one of the best things I have ever seen in my life. Love that show so much. I had Dirty Pair to watch raw as I bought the Jp DVDs back in 2003. Still need to get the LD box and OVA discs. I am surprised BV has not released the movie on BD yet. Love that movie so much. First saw it in 1996 when I bought the Streamline VHS from cartoon gallery. OVAs as well. Surprised VAP didn't break out DP early for BD as well!

I have the individual double disc LDs for Orguss, but never got the box. The box art is typical, gorgeous Mikimoto art, but I was always annoyed by it not having proper covers which is why I chose the singles, or doubles I guess.

As for Japanese, apart from watching anime raw and playing MEGA DRIVE, PC Engine, SuFami and Saturn RPGs, I think the biggest moment for me was playing LUNAR: The Silver Star on my Wondermega in Japan and actually being able to read and understand everything. Eternal Blue came the next year. The "English" versions are crap and full of yank references. Was so nice to play the originals. I adore those games! Popful Mail on the MEGA-CD was another that working designs ruined for their "english" version.

Oh, actually GETTING a Wondermega in Japan was big for me too! I got a naked VICTOR model. There was a boxed, mint SEGA model in Akita for ¥39,800 that I really, really wish I had bought. They are impossible to get now and 3 times that price. I had to save money for the PS3 at the end of the year....gah.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 15:40 
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signofzeta wrote:
What's the worst anime you've ever seen?


well, MARTIAN SUCCESSOR NADESICO (1997) has certainly managed to find itself well within the top running.

finally got around to picking up the NOZOMI Blu-Ray complete collection after hearing good things about the series off-and-on
since first learning of it back in a late-90's/early-00's issue of ANIMERICA.

well, was it worth nearly a good twenty years of occasional hype? Not Really.

i mean, i still have the movie and OVA to sit through, but i just finished the T.V. series last night, and... NOTHING MADE ANY DAMNED SENSE.
the the storytelling was incoherent, and the general flow of damn near everything was the very definition of slapdash and scatterbrained.

the solid ideas were quite there, and fully ready to be exploited, even. the NADESICO T.V. series, however, hardly couldn't have managed to do a poorer job of it all.

my rear end is rather extra crispy at the moment, having being flambe'd recently by so many ostensible Anime "Classics" and all. Just Saying... :thumbdown: :sick: :thumbdown:
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 16:17 
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I couldn't get into Nadesico way back when.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 17:28 
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I’m not a massive Nadesico fan but I had very little trouble understanding it. I can pretty much recall the entire plot and I haven’t seen it since it was a fan sub. The earth military can’t fight the bad guys anymore so they hire a corporate battleship ship and crew. The enemies turn out to be space ota for an old anime that also inspired Earth’s #1 ace to be a pilot. Then they go to Jupiter and finish things off.

I didn’t watch the movie. I have the Gekiganger OVA because that was my favorite part of the show, like most people I think.

Tasuke: I think you watch anime wrong. You watch dubs and you complain about how you can’t understand such and such as if that’s some sort of issue. Anime isn’t meant to be %100 understood at a glance. Ok, I take that back. The maid shows and other moe crap I guess isn’t supposed to give the audience too much credit but almost all of the best anime leave the viewer with many questions. If you watch something and are left with no questions...what you just watched probably sucked.

As as for Nadesico being anywhere near “worst” or even “bad” I think again you just haven’t seen that much anime. OVAs based on chick sims are not good anime. Maybe you’d just need to grow from that or something. If Nadesico confuses you than Akira or Angel’s Egg must put you into a fitful coma.


Last edited by signofzeta on 25 Apr 2019, 18:07, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 17:39 
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The same goes for live action movies as well. Though I can definitely turn my brain off to watch and enjoy crap.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 18:24 
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Anime is in Japanese though, and integral to that is super vague meaning quite often. If I left a James Cameron movie not getting something that probably would be a failure on his part. Titanic isn’t a metaphor for anything whatsoever, its just the actual thing. Same with Terminator. They explain everything. Many many things from Japan though are massively more vague or referential. Shaka, when the walls fell. The thing you don’t get might very well not be in the movie/TV/OVA. You didn’t miss it, it’s not the translation, it’s literally unexplained. Sometimes there is a info sheet or a prior manga or something but that doesn’t explain Royal Space Force or Birth or DYRL and nothing will EVER explain 999 but it’s still amazingly good.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 18:27 
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I feel the 6 volumes of Akira was more confusing to me than the film, but both are not just a quick watch and done.

Also I feel that some of the anime was just pumped out and is total crap, no matter how cool it is, it was and is a money making machine.

I don't remember verbatim but part of the commentary on Golgo 13 was spot on, he said there were some animation companies in Japan that WON'T many
any anime unless its sort of paid for by the US market first then they will make it.

Oh 999 is amazing on so many levels, and there are so many messages it gives you.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 25 Apr 2019, 18:44 
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signofzeta wrote:
Anime is in Japanese though, and integral to that is super vague meaning quite often. If I left a James Cameron movie not getting something that probably would be a failure on his part. Titanic isn’t a metaphor for anything whatsoever, its just the actual thing. Same with Terminator. They explain everything. Many many things from Japan though are massively more vague or referential. Shaka, when the walls fell. The thing you don’t get might very well not be in the movie/TV/OVA. You didn’t miss it, it’s not the translation, it’s literally unexplained. Sometimes there is a info sheet or a prior manga or something but that doesn’t explain Royal Space Force or Birth or DYRL and nothing will EVER explain 999 but it’s still amazingly good.


It might be because I've been watching loads of Japanese LA movies lately. Kurosawa, Mizoguchi, Osu. The MASTERS.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 08:04 
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I remember when Nadesico came out and the hype. Yeah I wasn't into the character designs and saw a few fansubbed eps and left me cold. It was around the time of the end of anime anyway.

Zeta, can you explain to me the story of the Appleseed manga? Coz I've read the Studio Proteus translation over and over for 20 years and I still don't get it. Why does an appleseed have to shot into GAIA again? I love the art, the special forces fetishism, the girls, the characters and the world but the big picture story I never got.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 10:18 
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rein-o wrote:
Oh 999 is amazing on so many levels, and there are so many messages it gives you.

Are we talking about Galaxy Express 999?
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 10:52 
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segasonic91 wrote:
Ayu's shows are always amazing! The Miss(un)derstood tour was great. I am still pissed she didn't sing SURREAL on that tour, first tour she dropped it and it is my favourite song! The live version is always awesome!! I desperately wanted to go to the Countdown Live 2006 show but it waa impossible. The day for public ticket sales came and I was at the local convini first thing. 2 seconds, litterally, past 10am it said SOLD OUT.

You are right about Utada Hikaru. She is no Ayu when it comes to live performance. She just kind of stands there and doesn't do much. The crowd was boring as hell as well. Even for Japan! The 2006 DVD was my show in Saitama. Well, it is a mixture of my show and the second show in Saitama. It was her last tour before she "retired" though, so I am really glad I got to see her. Damn shame I wasn't in Tokyo so I could see L'arc en Ciel for their Tokyo Dome anniversary shows! Love them and HYDE's solo stuff.


Very cool!

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Oh and Maison Ikkoku.... one of the best things I have ever seen in my life.


yeah it's so good, the way mundane items in everyday Japan are depicted so well in backgrounds and apartments etc, it's so real to me. The station in the show is based on the station I used every day to get to my university back then too. I think the station got decomissioned recently. The "snacks" around the station are exactly like in the show. Just hole in the wall quaint little places with faux European styling..I'm sure the ryokan could have been based on so many around the area that looked just like that.

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I had Dirty Pair to watch raw as I bought the Jp DVDs back in 2003. Still need to get the LD box and OVA discs. I am surprised BV has not released the movie on BD yet. Love that movie so much. First saw it in 1996 when I bought the Streamline VHS from cartoon gallery. OVAs as well. Surprised VAP didn't break out DP early for BD as well!


Yeah DP is one of those classic bubble era shows, episodic but packed with detail and otaku coolness.

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I have the individual double disc LDs for Orguss, but never got the box. The box art is typical, gorgeous Mikimoto art, but I was always annoyed by it not having proper covers which is why I chose the singles, or doubles I guess.


Oh okay, fair enough.

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As for Japanese, apart from watching anime raw and playing MEGA DRIVE, PC Engine, SuFami and Saturn RPGs, I think the biggest moment for me was playing LUNAR: The Silver Star on my Wondermega in Japan and actually being able to read and understand everything. Eternal Blue came the next year. The "English" versions are crap and full of yank references. Was so nice to play the originals. I adore those games! Popful Mail on the MEGA-CD was another that working designs ruined for their "english" version.

Oh, actually GETTING a Wondermega in Japan was big for me too! I got a naked VICTOR model. There was a boxed, mint SEGA model in Akita for ¥39,800 that I really, really wish I had bought. They are impossible to get now and 3 times that price. I had to save money for the PS3 at the end of the year....gah.


Wondermega, nice. I think you actually became the Otaking I wanted to become back in the '90s
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 14:56 
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tasuke wrote:
signofzeta wrote:
What's the worst anime you've ever seen?


well, MARTIAN SUCCESSOR NADESICO (1997) has certainly managed to find itself well within the top running.

finally got around to picking up the NOZOMI Blu-Ray complete collection after hearing good things about the series off-and-on
since first learning of it back in a late-90's/early-00's issue of ANIMERICA.

well, was it worth nearly a good twenty years of occasional hype? Not Really.

i mean, i still have the movie and OVA to sit through, but i just finished the T.V. series last night, and... NOTHING MADE ANY DAMNED SENSE.
the the storytelling was incoherent, and the general flow of damn near everything was the very definition of slapdash and scatterbrained.

the solid ideas were quite there, and fully ready to be exploited, even. the NADESICO T.V. series, however, hardly couldn't have managed to do a poorer job of it all.

my rear end is rather extra crispy at the moment, having being flambe'd recently by so many ostensible Anime "Classics" and all. Just Saying... :thumbdown: :sick: :thumbdown:


I hated it a first because that one guy was annoying and I stopped. Then I started it again and after he dies I thought it was better and more interesting. The whole time travel part was confusing. The movie is odd as it seems to be more serious among other things.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 15:02 
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signofzeta wrote:
As as for Nadesico being anywhere near “worst” or even “bad” I think again you just haven’t seen that much anime.
OVAs based on chick sims are not good anime. Maybe you’d just need to grow from that or something.
If Nadesico confuses you than Akira or Angel’s Egg must put you into a fitful coma.



i've seen, -and own and cherish- quite a few true classic Anime of yore, chief among them SDF MACROSS, DYRL, MACROSS II and MACROSS PLUS.

NADESICO, to me, is BAD. bad, because all the seeds of greatness are quite there. it is not hard at all to understand the general thrust of it, either.

what IS hard to understand is the fly-by-night, scattershot execution of it all. the series is just too scatterbrained and slapdash in it's pacing.
it gyrates far too suddenly and wildly in it's tonal shifts,
and generally makes what should be a pretty straightforward story feel like an absolute ADHD pain in the rear.

and, if you can believe it, the "Movie" is far, FAR worse still...
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 15:06 
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takeshi666 wrote:
rein-o wrote:
Oh 999 is amazing on so many levels, and there are so many messages it gives you.

Are we talking about Galaxy Express 999?

Yes, NOT WORSE.........

Zeta was talking about it and I was just mentioning it too :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 17:17 
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I was referring to it’s inscrutable genius.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 17:23 
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signofzeta wrote:
I was referring to it’s inscrutable genius.

Yes, I was commenting and agreeing with it.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 19:42 
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I kind of have mixed feelings about 999. In one hand, it is THE anime of my childhood - when most anime distributed on VHS back then was the kind of bland slice of life stuff that was guaranteed to offend absolutely nobody, 999 was one of the few exceptions I had the chance to see - and when I finally saw the movie (without subtitles!) I absolutely loved it, and when I finally found the fansubs to the TV series, I couldn't wait to see it. Unfortunately I found the actual TV anime somewhat underwhelming, mostly thanks to it near complete lack of continuity.
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 Post subject: Re: What's the worst anime you've ever seen?
PostPosted: 26 Apr 2019, 22:36 
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tasuke wrote:
it gyrates far too suddenly and wildly in it's tonal shifts,


This is ALMOST all anime, some are more ridiculous than others about it. Trigun is a BIG offender.
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