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DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=562		 Page 6 of 17
Author:  elahrairrah [ 27 Feb 2013, 23:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
acuozzo wrote:
elahrairrah: Are you able to get simultaneous component and s-video output from your DMR-ES25?

Haven't tried, but I have an occasion when I will want to try. I will let you know.
Author:  acuozzo [ 28 Feb 2013, 08:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
elahrairrah wrote:
acuozzo wrote:
elahrairrah: Are you able to get simultaneous component and s-video output from your DMR-ES25?

Haven't tried, but I have an occasion when I will want to try. I will let you know.

OK, thanks!
Author:  acuozzo [ 12 Mar 2013, 17:40 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Does anyone have any of the Toshiba RD-XS* DVD Recorders?

I hear they have great 3D comb filters. I'd like to see one in action.
Author:  hauntmedoitagain [ 17 Mar 2013, 04:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Not to hijack this thread or anything, but: any VCRs with good comb filters out there?

Already have 5+ devices that can play DVDs so I'd rather invest in something nicer for my VHS collection.

I'm assuming I'd have to go with a late S-VHS deck, just don't know which models are worth checking out.
Author:  signofzeta [ 17 Mar 2013, 05:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
hauntmedoitagain wrote:
Not to hijack this thread or anything, but: any VCRs with good comb filters out there?

Already have 5+ devices that can play DVDs so I'd rather invest in something nicer for my VHS collection.

I'm assuming I'd have to go with a late S-VHS deck, just don't know which models are worth checking out.


I remember some really nice SVHS decks from the mid 90s. My friend had this prosumer Mitsubishi with a digital time base corrector, etc. I was *killer* for the time, but I'm pretty sure the comb filters of the mid 2000s are overall much better. And obviously no 90s VCR is going to have HDMI, upscaling, etc.

However, I have a JVC DR-MV150B that is a DVD recorder and VCR combo. I haven't really spent a lot of time analyzing its capabilities but it seems pretty nice. Right now its downstairs in my workshop hooked up to a 17" PVM making copies of LDs for friends. Watching these DVDs I made on HDTVs they look pretty great.

A few cautions though: the entire until was only $200 about two years ago. I can't imagine the actual VCR in this thing is probably all that great. I wouldn't put a lot of hours on it! :) Also, it doesn't record to dual layer DVDs so the XP (highest quality) setting only gets you an hour, and the SP (second highest) only gets you two, and you don't want to use the other ones.

Eventually I'll see what the HDMI looks like. I'm not in a hurry since I still have good CRTs around the house, but I'm stockpiling this stuff for the future when I'm 60 and all the tubes are gone. :(

Overall, I think that, with very rare exception, by the time 3D comb filters that were both good and cheap came about the idea of a quality VCR was only a memory. Your best chance is probably some pro deck that is extremely rare.

EDIT: checking eBay, Amazon, etc, it appears that this unit is something of a cult favorite. Its sold out everywhere and the used ones go for more than it did new. I guess I'm lucky to have two of them. :)
Author:  elahrairrah [ 17 Mar 2013, 06:54 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
The JVC S-VHS decks with the model numbers HRS-7xxx and 9xxx should have 3D comb filters. I think the 9xxx has more memory though (2MB vs 4MB.)
Author:  elahrairrah [ 17 Mar 2013, 07:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
On that note, I wonder if this thing has a good 3D comb filter?

Image
JVC SR-W7U W-VHS VCR
Author:  signofzeta [ 17 Mar 2013, 07:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
A HiVision VHS deck?

...mind blown...
Author:  elahrairrah [ 17 Mar 2013, 07:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Here's another item that I wonder about as I've never seen this before:

JVC SR-MV30U S-VHS/DVD Recorder

Would certainly make dubbing my S-VHS recordings to DVD easier! :lol:
Author:  signofzeta [ 17 Mar 2013, 11:41 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
FWIW, the unit I mentioned does quasi SVHS playback.
Author:  elahrairrah [ 29 Mar 2013, 17:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
If only this thing was a VCR rather than just a VHS player . . .

Image
Panasonic DMP-BD70V Blu-ray Disc/VHS Multimedia Player

The specs sound good for the upscaling of VHS
Quote:
VHS Playback and 1080p HDMI Out Deep Color and x.v.Color 148.5MHz/12bit Video D/A Converter Digital Noise Reduction (3D-NR/ Integrated NR) Picture Mode (Normal, Soft, Fine, Cinema, User) Picture Adjustment (Contrast, Brightness, Sharpness, Color, Gamma Correction)
But alas, just a VHS player. No video inputs. Thus, no way to run an LD player through it!

One reviewer said it does wonders for VHS:
Quote:
The DMP-BD70V upconversion of the VHS to 1080p is really quite amazing. My current television is a 42" HDTV (one year ago it was a 19 inch color set) When I connected my previous standard VHS player to the HDTV, the picture quality, as expected, was quite poor, with much of the image being rather pixelated - it was quite painful and distracting to watch.

Then I hooked up the DMP-BD70V, and lone behold, the picture quality was much, much better - and very watchable. At first I almost thought that the VHS tape had been replaced by a DVD - the improvement was that great. There was no pixelation at all, and the colors were quite bright. The overall quality of the picture was much better than the picture obtained with my old 19" color TV and VHS player. The upscaling features of the DMP-BD70V is almost as if a magician had waved his wand over your entire library of VHS tapes, and suddenly replaced them, Cinderella-like, with a much higher quality product.
One other notes that it only does well with VHS on HDTVs through HDMI, not component:
Quote:
The component connection from this player to an HDTV did not work well with VHS tapes as the picture appeared all smudged. The tapes looked fine with an HDMI connection.
Ah well . . .
Author:  msgohan [ 29 Mar 2013, 18:21 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
VHS -> HDTV = "pixelated"? Seems doubtful.

And "lone behold" means zero credibility with me. :)
Author:  elahrairrah [ 29 Mar 2013, 19:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
msgohan wrote:
VHS -> HDTV = "pixelated"? Seems doubtful.

And "lone behold" means zero credibility with me. :)

I've seen it if the HDTV itself has crappy built-in upscalers. Thankfully they got better in the mid to late '00s.
Author:  circlesky73 [ 01 Apr 2013, 22:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
msgohan wrote:
VHS -> HDTV = "pixelated"? Seems doubtful.

And "lone behold" means zero credibility with me. :)


At least they didn't say "VCR movie tapes"! :clap:
Author:  hauntmedoitagain [ 07 Apr 2013, 02:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
I ended up buying a DMR-ES10 based on these screen caps and… wow, I couldn't be happier with the image I'm getting. I had no idea Laserdisc could look this good, even on my lowly CLD-3070; the non-destructive noise reduction is a blessing, as well.

If there's one thing I've learned from these forums, it's how underrated Panasonic really is. Would definitely recommend this DVD recorder to anyone looking to improve their LD experience! :thumbup:

acuozzo wrote:
I wanted to test my Panasonic DMR-ES10's comb filter in the most "pure" way, so I fed it the composite output of my Panasonic DVD-S29 playing Digital Video Essentials. I then took the s-video output of my Panasonic DMR-ES10 and fed it to my Hauppauge USB-Live2 capture card. Everything was reverted to default/factory settings prior to the capture. Here are the results:

Still
Image

Moving
Image

Download a 31-frame-long sample here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/fbt23kkwslnxz ... Sample.avi

The sample is losslessly-compressed with the Lagarith codec and is set to play at 1fps. It's ~5.8MB.

Enjoy!
Author:  sdraper [ 07 Apr 2013, 22:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Is there any kind of inexpensive unit that has some decent amount of image improvement? I've about had it with trying to get LD to look better on my Sony CRT. I've even considered digging out my tiny old CRT with rounded edges because that at least hid everything.
Author:  hauntmedoitagain [ 08 Apr 2013, 02:45 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
sdraper wrote:
Is there any kind of inexpensive unit that has some decent amount of image improvement? I've about had it with trying to get LD to look better on my Sony CRT. I've even considered digging out my tiny old CRT with rounded edges because that at least hid everything.


What issues are you having?
Author:  sdraper [ 08 Apr 2013, 20:52 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
See here:
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=2441

It's primarily just having all LD footage on my CRT screen appear fuzzy, pixelated and full of noise. Nothing else does this, not even old video games on composite video. So I'm really thinking it's a comb filter related issue.
Author:  hauntmedoitagain [ 09 Apr 2013, 08:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
All of your LDs exhibit this? :shock:

To me it just sounds like a bad pressing. My copies of Escape From New York and The Thing both have this sort of issue due to aliasing from poor mastering procedures, but it's just these discs, not the rest of my collection.

The DMR-ES10 did help these to some degree, but they still pale in comparison to the better discs in my collection.
Author:  elahrairrah [ 12 Jun 2013, 20:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
So I got another DVD recorder I've used.

Toshiba DV-R620 DVD/VCR combo - nice colors and does pretty well with dot-crawl, but ineffective against cross color. About the same performance as the Toshiba D-R2 (possibly the same filter?)

I'll add that to the earlier post with the list of recorders.
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