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DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=562		 Page 15 of 17
Author:  rein-o [ 11 Sep 2019, 14:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
jakeheke wrote:
Quick noob question. Found a DMR ES15 /ES25 locally cheap. Working but the DVD tray is busted. As long as i have the remote i can make use of it to use it to 3D comb between my LD player and TV correct?


I remember reading a post here that some will shut off after a period of time not being used.
So if you just use it as a filter it may shut off after 20 minutes?? Only issue you need to worry about?
Author:  takeshi666 [ 11 Sep 2019, 17:27 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
I'm pretty sure "not being used" means it's not receiving any signal at all. If you're routing another device through it, that shouldn't be a problem.
Author:  jakeheke [ 12 Sep 2019, 03:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Sweet. Doubted tray busted would affect it.
Author:  deadlegion [ 12 Sep 2019, 06:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
I've got a Panasonic DMR-XW350 here, think I might do some testing using it in between my D750 and my lcd tv. I have hooked up to the tv directly using composite, but the tv is cheap and I suspect I might be able to get better results by using the panny. I might try s-video to the panny and then hdmi to the tv.

I do have a trintron with s-video anyway but I'm looking for a way to run LD on my theatre setup (the crt is for old consoles).
I don't expect amazing results.
Author:  audioboyz1973 [ 12 Sep 2019, 10:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
deadlegion wrote:
I've got a Panasonic DMR-XW350 here, think I might do some testing using it in between my D750 and my lcd tv. I have hooked up to the tv directly using composite, but the tv is cheap and I suspect I might be able to get better results by using the panny. I might try s-video to the panny and then hdmi to the tv.

I do have a trintron with s-video anyway but I'm looking for a way to run LD on my theatre setup (the crt is for old consoles).
I don't expect amazing results.

If the purpose is to use the comb filter in the DVD recorder as per the thread title then feeding it s-video is completely pointless.
Author:  deadlegion [ 12 Sep 2019, 11:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
audioboyz1973 wrote:
If the purpose is to use the comb filter in the DVD recorder as per the thread title then feeding it s-video is completely pointless.


Ok I shouldn't have posted here at all.
Author:  audioboyz1973 [ 12 Sep 2019, 11:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Maybe you just want to use/try out it's scaling?

But if your intention was to use it's comb filter then there's no point feeding it s-video; you're then using the one in the LD player. Maybe that's pointing out the obvious for you, but so many people haven't done the research and just don't get how it works...
Author:  deadlegion [ 12 Sep 2019, 13:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
audioboyz1973 wrote:
Maybe you just want to use/try out it's scaling?

But if your intention was to use it's comb filter then there's no point feeding it s-video; you're then using the one in the LD player. Maybe that's pointing out the obvious for you, but so many people haven't done the research and just don't get how it works...


I probably don't get how it works. I see output quality and I'm interested in improving it even just slightly via lcd.
Using composite to lcd doesn't look very good and s-video isn't possible on that panel.

Scaling, maybe. The s-video out of the D750 isn't great (on trinitron crt) so I was wondering if the XW350 could improve that, think it has some options.
Also, I don't necessarily need to use the hdmi out on the XW350 I could use component out and choose whatever res I want up to 1080i.
Think it has side cut and zoom too...which I don't think I can get any other way with what I have here (I don't have the D750 manual).
Author:  audioboyz1973 [ 12 Sep 2019, 14:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
If you're outputting from the recorder to LCD go HDMI, component will only result in extra stages of conversion digital>analogue>digital plus interlacing/de-interlacing.

The whole job of the comb filter is to take the composite signal and separate it back out into the Y (luminance/brightness) and C (chrominance/colour) signals. So if you want to use the comb filter in the recorder then feed it composite; if you feed it s-video (Y/C) then the signal's already been separated by the LD player comb filter and the one in the recorder becomes redundant and is bypassed.

Best of all spend some time reading the forums and/or google about scaling and de-interlacing and comb filters etc. - so much information is available to learn. Nothing beats being able to make informed decisions about all this stuff!!
Author:  deadlegion [ 12 Sep 2019, 15:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
audioboyz1973 wrote:
If you're outputting from the recorder to LCD go HDMI, component will only result in extra stages of conversion digital>analogue>digital plus interlacing/de-interlacing.

The whole job of the comb filter is to take the composite signal and separate it back out into the Y (luminance/brightness) and C (chrominance/colour) signals. So if you want to use the comb filter in the recorder then feed it composite; if you feed it s-video (Y/C) then the signal's already been separated by the LD player comb filter and the one in the recorder becomes redundant and is bypassed.

Best of all spend some time reading the forums and/or google about scaling and de-interlacing and comb filters etc. - so much information is available to learn. Nothing beats being able to make informed decisions about all this stuff!!


Hmmm, ok.
So would using the composite output from the D750 be the better option to begin with then?
The only units I have to play with are the DMR-XW350 (DVDR/HDD) and JVC HR-XVS20AA (SVHS/DVD). I did try to do some reading about those units but can't find anything about comb filters involved so I guess they're probably crap. Well, the JVC I guess it's crap as it's an older unit and surely someone would have mentioned it somewhere. The XW350 I'm not sure about though, and yeah the fact it has hdmi made me think about improving picture quality on lcd.

I'm not looking at buying anything just curious about using what I have to make an improvement even if only slight.
Author:  audioboyz1973 [ 12 Sep 2019, 15:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
I'd try composite first; chances are the newer recorder would have the better comb filter, but the only way to really know which way (if any) improves things over letting the TV do it is to experiment and try the different combinations. This and some other threads mention devices with a reputation for good comb filters, and though what you have may not be one of those, it still could be an improvement.
Author:  signofzeta [ 12 Sep 2019, 15:57 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
deadlegion wrote:
audioboyz1973 wrote:
If you're outputting from the recorder to LCD go HDMI, component will only result in extra stages of conversion digital>analogue>digital plus interlacing/de-interlacing.

The whole job of the comb filter is to take the composite signal and separate it back out into the Y (luminance/brightness) and C (chrominance/colour) signals. So if you want to use the comb filter in the recorder then feed it composite; if you feed it s-video (Y/C) then the signal's already been separated by the LD player comb filter and the one in the recorder becomes redundant and is bypassed.

Best of all spend some time reading the forums and/or google about scaling and de-interlacing and comb filters etc. - so much information is available to learn. Nothing beats being able to make informed decisions about all this stuff!!


Hmmm, ok.
So would using the composite output from the D750 be the better option to begin with then?
The only units I have to play with are the DMR-XW350 (DVDR/HDD) and JVC HR-XVS20AA (SVHS/DVD). I did try to do some reading about those units but can't find anything about comb filters involved so I guess they're probably crap. Well, the JVC I guess it's crap as it's an older unit and surely someone would have mentioned it somewhere. The XW350 I'm not sure about though, and yeah the fact it has hdmi made me think about improving picture quality on lcd.

I'm not looking at buying anything just curious about using what I have to make an improvement even if only slight.


Have you calibrated with a test disc? The biggest change you can make LD look way better on crap LCDs is to turn the brightness way way way down. Don’t buy random stuff for “improvements” until the stuff you already have is working at its best.
Author:  deadlegion [ 12 Sep 2019, 16:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
signofzeta wrote:
Have you calibrated with a test disc? The biggest change you can make LD look way better on crap LCDs is to turn the brightness way way way down. Don’t buy random stuff for “improvements” until the stuff you already have is working at its best.


I'm not looking to buy stuff, random or otherwise :eh:
This is crap I already have lying around. If I do get random stuff it was free or virtually free along with some other stuff that I wanted.

For LD test disc I have nothing and there's nothing cheap here. Maybe one of the LD's I have has a test chapter on it...maybe? :think:

Man I shouldn't have posted at all :lol:
Author:  gypsy [ 12 Sep 2019, 22:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Many Criterions have test patterns on them.
Author:  deadlegion [ 14 Sep 2019, 16:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
gypsy wrote:
Many Criterions have test patterns on them.


I don't think I have any criterions on any format.
Author:  deadlegion [ 14 Sep 2019, 17:22 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
There's a copy of Sony: The Test Disc (1995) [00MW-0009] on ebay atm, Malaysian seller. It isn't cheap so no way I'm buying it. I can see "Muse color" on the back cover and lddb lists the title as hi-vision LD. Does such a disc require a special player?

I'm not aware of anything else.
Author:  takeshi666 [ 14 Sep 2019, 17:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Yes, it requires a Hi-Vision player.

Don't buy one.
Author:  audioboyz1973 [ 14 Sep 2019, 18:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
If you're looking to buy a test disc Video Essentials is the go to for most.

There's a few random titles with some test pattern/colour bars at the end of the disc, but then you might need VE anyway to teach you how to use it and for the blue filter to adjust colour and tint. If you do find one of those using it to adjust the brightness properly is pretty straight forward though.
Author:  rein-o [ 14 Sep 2019, 20:02 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
Video Standard and Video Essentials are your friend, one is easier to use than the other.
Author:  deadlegion [ 15 Sep 2019, 01:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: DVD Recorders with 3D Comb Filters
I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on a used LD test disc that may or may not get damaged during shipping
Yeah I can't use the Sony one but at least it was under $100aud. Not that I would pay anywhere near that anyway...costing more than Apes box set is ridiculous.

I do have DVD and BD calibration discs.
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