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 Post subject: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2020, 20:40 
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Hello! I’m a college student who is completely new to laserdisc. In fact, I just got my first ones today! I was delighted to find that the old player I found on eBay worked fantastic until the end of side A of The Andromeda Strain, when it stopped, and I waited for it to change over to Side B, but it never happened. I’ve tried pressing the Disc Side B button instead of play, both when the disc is loaded and when it’s on the tray ready to be. Any ideas as to what might be my culprit, and how to fix it?
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 00:03 
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I would open the top cover and watch the movements when playing the laserdisc to the end of side A.
A video might be of help to diagnose the problem.
It can be something gummed up preventing it from doing a flip, loose or missing parts, and also the loading/motor belt might not have enough tension to help make the turn. A belt with less tension might be working erratically and giving you problems when trying to flip the disc.
Since no action is happening when you press the side B button, it can also relate to an electrical fault somewhere.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 00:15 
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Is there a transit screw installed in the back?
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 02:38 
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laserpaal wrote:
Since no action is happening when you press the side B button, it can also relate to an electrical fault somewhere.


On double-sided model, upon loading and detecting a LD (as opposed to CD since it's LD/CD player), the player tries to read the TOC (table of contents) and there's one bit of information telling if you are playing side A or side B and if the disc is double-sided. Even single-sided players can tell if they are playing side A or side B of a disc.

If the player can't read that piece of information correctly, it won't try to switch over to side B automatically or respond to the "B" button on the remote.

Side question: does anyone know how the TOC is encoded on a LD? Is there a specification available somewhere?

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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 04:28 
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I was going to say what Admin said. I’ve had this problem with a 99 and the issue was the grip ring. If the disc slips too much on startup it won’t read the TOC correctly but for some reason it continues to play the disc. Some features may not work once the disc is up and running (side switch, variable DNR, DTS audio) but it plays anyway.

The 2080 has little in common with the 99 but perhaps the same thing can happen.

Do you have any two sided 8” LDs? If those play or if the problem comes and goes I would look into increasing traction at the disc/hub connection.

If you have an LD you don’t care much about you could do something with tape or whatever to increase grip. If that fixes the side flipping then traction is for sure your issue.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 08:29 
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signofzeta wrote:

The 2080 has little in common with the 99 but perhaps the same thing can happen.


I can concur that it does happen on the older models too. My Pro-Scan, PSLD43 (CLD-2090 clone) will occasional mess up on the TOC read and basically spins down the player and won't re-engage until the disc comes to a complete stop (which takes over a minute) and then I have to pop the disc out and try it again.

The solution in the past is to clean the grip ring but obviously it still will happen every so often. I don't think it's a defect in the player as there could be other factors causing the issue such as an imperfect disc or an excessively smooth surface on the section of the disc that the player clamps to.

Also, I don't think discs w/o the TOC has any issues with this but I could be wrong.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 09:58 
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trent991 wrote:
I’ve tried pressing the Disc Side B button instead of play, both when the disc is loaded and when it’s on the tray ready to be.


That's more problematic, since that is prior to trying to reach the TOC.
Player should assume there is something to play on Side B and load/spin up/reverse/play...

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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 17:52 
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admin wrote:
trent991 wrote:
I’ve tried pressing the Disc Side B button instead of play, both when the disc is loaded and when it’s on the tray ready to be.


That's more problematic, since that is prior to trying to reach the TOC.
Player should assume there is something to play on Side B and load/spin up/reverse/play...

Julien


Indeed. I just tried it with another LD, Highlander 3, and the same issue occurred. If the fix is costly, at least I can still manually flip the discs. I should add that the cover for the disc tray is broken, and I keep it closed with a piece of electrical tape. Could this have something to do with it?
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 18:34 
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I’ll try and send a video tonight, after class.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2020, 23:52 
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If you pressed B with the tray open and it still doesn’t go to side B and play it is not a slipping grip ring as the laser after detecting a disc is present should flip directly to side B and try to read the TOC there. So a video of the laser movement when pressing side B to close the tray would be helpful. Need to see if the laser goes back into the turn mechanism and if the turn completes.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 00:53 
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admin wrote:
Side question: does anyone know how the TOC is encoded on a LD? Is there a specification available somewhere?


IEC 60857. I would love to take a look but it is ridiculously expensive.

Free options:
http://www.daphne-emu.com/mediawiki/index.php/VBIInfo
https://github.com/happycube/ld-decode/ ... ecoder.cpp
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 04:32 
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Here it is. Doesn’t seem to want to play it!
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 05:27 
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Side B centering might be the problem.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 05:29 
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cplusplus wrote:
Side B centering might be the problem.


I’m a total newbie, haha. What’s this mean, and how can I fix it?
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 05:37 
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The laser might not be centered over the spindle motor. This is a mechanical adjustment. I'd wait for krbahr to weigh in though- he is the expert.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 05:39 
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trent991 wrote:
cplusplus wrote:
Side B centering might be the problem.

I’m a total newbie, haha. What’s this mean, and how can I fix it?


Means the laser can't properly detect a disc when flipping the optical block for a B-side play, it then gives up -- clueless.

My opinion: this player probably needs professional calibration for B-side. For now, it's a single-sided player at least!

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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 05:47 
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admin wrote:
My opinion: this player probably needs professional calibration for B-side. For now, it's a single-sided player at least!


Uff da! Thanks for the help, but I sure hope this isn’t the case! Where am I going to find a LaserDisc repair shop in small town Wisconsin in 2020!? :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2020, 16:09 
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trent991 wrote:
admin wrote:
My opinion: this player probably needs professional calibration for B-side. For now, it's a single-sided player at least!


Uff da! Thanks for the help, but I sure hope this isn’t the case! Where am I going to find a LaserDisc repair shop in small town Wisconsin in 2020!? :lol:


Where are you going to find a LaserDisc repair shop in a big city like LA, NY, IL or other in 2020 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 01 Feb 2020, 01:29 
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I've never been a fan of the CLD-X080 series of players. It would appear that this player has to obtain focus before engaging the spindle motor. This isn't going to be the centering adjustment because that we would still get a disc spin-up even with the centering off. This feels like a focus issue when playing side B, but my gut says the tilt offset for Side B is off. If the tilt offset is wrong, it might prevent the lens from achieving focus.

Can you get a video across the top of the disc and look at the lens as it tries to play Side B? I would expect to see lens movement up and down while trying to attain focus.
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 Post subject: Re: [CLD-2080] Side B will not play
PostPosted: 01 Feb 2020, 03:41 
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I agree, this is not a centering issue, this is a detection that a disc is there. I have actually seen a few laser pickups that have issues in the side B upside down position. I don't have the tools to disassemble the laser in a way to tell why this is. But if these were ever banged around in shipment something in the laser path (laser, lenses. mirror, detectors) must be a little loose and a slight shift when turning over could cause the machine to not focus on the disc.
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