It is currently 17 May 2021, 20:31




 Page 1 of 2 [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn smell
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 16:32 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
I got a used CLD-M90. It needed a new load belt. It loads LD's and CD's and everything was looking good, then I pressed PLAY for the first time. It started to spin slowly for about 20 seconds as it started giving off a sour burning odor. Sort of a fishy (literally) odor. The disc stopped spinning and the display read STOP. I tried again and the same result. Just a slow spin and then stop. I tried a CD. It loads the CD's fine, but barely spins for a few seconds and then stops. I can't tell if the smell is the motor or the power supply. All the fuses look fine as do all the other components on the power supply. Nothing looks burned and no bulging caps, etc. Any suggestions what my next step should be? I have the service manual. Also, I noticed that the motor didn't "brake" when the disc finally stopped. It just coasted to a stop. I have CLD-M403 that I can use for parts (motor) if necessary. It works but has a noisy picture. Thanks!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 17:48 
Advanced fan
Advanced fan
User avatar

Joined: 28 Jun 2014, 05:59
Posts: 853
Location: San Francisco, CA USA
Has thanked: 141 times
Been thanked: 241 times
Can you compare if the spindle motor on the M90 seems stiffer than the one in the M403 by spinning it with your fingers?
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 18:29 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
ldfan wrote:
Can you compare if the spindle motor on the M90 seems stiffer than the one in the M403 by spinning it with your fingers?


Ok. I think I "fixed" it. I disconnected the M90's motor from the player's PS and attached it to a separate 12v power supply. It spun slowly at first and then eventually sped up. I used a long thin metal rod with some oil on the tip it to put a few drops of oil at the motor shaft. I could smell that foul odor for a bit and then the motor started spinning quickly. I reattached it to the player's power supply and the disc played. Going to let it play for a few hours and see what happens.

BTW... as I had the unit apart, I found this tiny spring inside. Those are millimeters on that ruler. Any ideas where it goes?


Attachments:
spring1.jpg
spring1.jpg [ 40.92 KiB | Viewed 218 times ]
spring2.jpg
spring2.jpg [ 41.28 KiB | Viewed 218 times ]
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 19:38 
Hardcore fan
Hardcore fan
User avatar

Joined: 13 Aug 2018, 03:18
Posts: 1045
Has thanked: 277 times
Been thanked: 306 times
jimbanville1 wrote:
Sort of a fishy (literally) odor.

The PAC-S10 I'm recapping right now literally smells like a seafood restaurant dumpster when the leaked electrolytic is heated up.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 20:08 
Jedi Knight
Jedi Knight
User avatar

Joined: 14 Jan 2010, 09:44
Posts: 5161
Location: United States
Has thanked: 684 times
Been thanked: 688 times
jimbanville1 wrote:
ldfan wrote:
Can you compare if the spindle motor on the M90 seems stiffer than the one in the M403 by spinning it with your fingers?


Ok. I think I "fixed" it. I disconnected the M90's motor from the player's PS and attached it to a separate 12v power supply. It spun slowly at first and then eventually sped up. I used a long thin metal rod with some oil on the tip it to put a few drops of oil at the motor shaft. I could smell that foul odor for a bit and then the motor started spinning quickly. I reattached it to the player's power supply and the disc played. Going to let it play for a few hours and see what happens.

BTW... as I had the unit apart, I found this tiny spring inside. Those are millimeters on that ruler. Any ideas where it goes?


That’s very resourceful of you. I’m impressed. Most of our newer members just know how to complain about stuff broken in shipping.

Presumably your lab power supply had a higher current capacity than the one in the LD player. Were you able to see the current draw?
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 22:10 
Advanced fan
Advanced fan
User avatar

Joined: 28 Jun 2014, 05:59
Posts: 853
Location: San Francisco, CA USA
Has thanked: 141 times
Been thanked: 241 times
jimbanville1 wrote:

BTW... as I had the unit apart, I found this tiny spring inside. Those are millimeters on that ruler. Any ideas where it goes?


Not sure. I can look inside my M90 and see if I can locate a spring like that. Either way, I will reply back w/ some answer.

And like Zeta said, good job troubleshooting the motor issue. :thumbup:
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 22:52 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
ldfan wrote:
jimbanville1 wrote:

BTW... as I had the unit apart, I found this tiny spring inside. Those are millimeters on that ruler. Any ideas where it goes?


Not sure. I can look inside my M90 and see if I can locate a spring like that. Either way, I will reply back w/ some answer.

And like Zeta said, good job troubleshooting the motor issue. :thumbup:


Thanks, but it's not "fixed" yet. I tired stopping and starting it a few times and about half the time it will play and the other half it will spin for about 10-20 seconds and then coast to a stop and show STOP on the display.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 13 Apr 2021, 22:55 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
cplusplus wrote:
jimbanville1 wrote:
Sort of a fishy (literally) odor.

The PAC-S10 I'm recapping right now literally smells like a seafood restaurant dumpster when the leaked electrolytic is heated up.


I'm 99% sure its the motor that smells so bad. It's really disgusting.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 03:33 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
signofzeta wrote:
jimbanville1 wrote:
ldfan wrote:
Can you compare if the spindle motor on the M90 seems stiffer than the one in the M403 by spinning it with your fingers?


Ok. I think I "fixed" it. I disconnected the M90's motor from the player's PS and attached it to a separate 12v power supply. It spun slowly at first and then eventually sped up. I used a long thin metal rod with some oil on the tip it to put a few drops of oil at the motor shaft. I could smell that foul odor for a bit and then the motor started spinning quickly. I reattached it to the player's power supply and the disc played. Going to let it play for a few hours and see what happens.

BTW... as I had the unit apart, I found this tiny spring inside. Those are millimeters on that ruler. Any ideas where it goes?


That’s very resourceful of you. I’m impressed. Most of our newer members just know how to complain about stuff broken in shipping.

Presumably your lab power supply had a higher current capacity than the one in the LD player. Were you able to see the current draw?



So I gently opened the back of the motor. Lots of corrosion. I think those 3 capacitors you can barely see, leaked. I tried taking off the hub but its on there very sung. Might have to make some kind of puller. I want to replace those caps and see if I can refurnish this thing. Nothing to loose. Lol


Attachments:
motor3.jpg
motor3.jpg [ 30.97 KiB | Viewed 187 times ]
motor1.jpg
motor1.jpg [ 39.12 KiB | Viewed 187 times ]
motor2.jpg
motor2.jpg [ 72.09 KiB | Viewed 187 times ]
motor4.jpg
motor4.jpg [ 42.99 KiB | Viewed 187 times ]
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 05:29 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
I was able to get the spindle off without damaging it. I de-soldered the caps. The measure close to their rating, but for some reason my ESR meter doesn't show anything but their capacitance. No ESR measurement at all. I tested several new caps I have around the same rating as these and they do show ESR readouts. Weird.


Attachments:
motor5.jpg
motor5.jpg [ 34.37 KiB | Viewed 180 times ]
motor7.jpg
motor7.jpg [ 28.99 KiB | Viewed 180 times ]
motor8.jpg
motor8.jpg [ 42.34 KiB | Viewed 180 times ]
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 16:05 
Jedi Master
Jedi Master
User avatar

Joined: 03 May 2004, 19:05
Posts: 7122
Location: Dullaware
Has thanked: 700 times
Been thanked: 472 times
Wow, you are in uncharted territory.
People talk about rebuilding the spindle motor but haven't yet.
Keep up the work, I doubt it will work after all the work you do but if you succeed then others can learn from it,
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 16:20 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
rein-o wrote:
Wow, you are in uncharted territory.
People talk about rebuilding the spindle motor but haven't yet.
Keep up the work, I doubt it will work after all the work you do but if you succeed then others can learn from it,



I've rebuilt small electric motors. Some were successful. Some not. Any particular reason this shouldn't be successful? This motor's housing has a lip/ridge where the back plate rests. The unsuccessful rebuilds I've done in the past didn't have this. They relied on friction and having the back plate on in just the right spot. The back plate on this was not on very tight. Once I bent back the tiny nicks in the housing that held it on, I put a long thin sacrificial screwdriver into the large hole on the front of the housing and gave the back plate a few light taps on its inner side. Back popped off easily. I've ordered some replacement caps. Should be here in a few days. I was having trouble getting the hub off of the shaft. I really didn't want to damage the fragile plastic hub. Eventually I put the motor on the floor, I placed the inside edges of my feet on the sides of the housing and used fingertips from both hands to pull up on the hub as evenly as possible. It popped off without any issues.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 17:19 
Hardcore fan
Hardcore fan
User avatar

Joined: 13 Aug 2018, 03:18
Posts: 1045
Has thanked: 277 times
Been thanked: 306 times
This is excellent. Great job and thanks for all the photos. Looking forward to seeing this hopefully resurrected.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 17:50 
Advanced fan
Advanced fan
User avatar

Joined: 28 Jun 2014, 05:59
Posts: 853
Location: San Francisco, CA USA
Has thanked: 141 times
Been thanked: 241 times
Nice work getting the motor opened up. I too am looking forward to seeing your progress as this would definitely be useful information for the day I need to do it for my players. :thumbup:


Last edited by ldfan on 14 Apr 2021, 23:33, edited 1 time in total.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 18:18 
Jedi Master
Jedi Master
User avatar

Joined: 03 May 2004, 19:05
Posts: 7122
Location: Dullaware
Has thanked: 700 times
Been thanked: 472 times
jimbanville1 wrote:

I've rebuilt small electric motors. Some were successful. Some not. Any particular reason this shouldn't be successful? This motor's housing has a lip/ridge where the back plate rests.


Honestly I have no idea, I've never done this to these types of motors and only know what I've read in the past or when I talked
with some techs many, many years ago.

Also when the tech were doing this they had access to actual parts and just dropped another one in and forgot about the old one.
We don't have those extra parts and only can salvage them from other players with bad issues hopefully not motor issues but other stuff.

I too can't see why it wouldn't work and saw you posted in the other topic and that's the furthest I've ever seen anybody doing this.

But keep us posted. :thumbup:
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 14 Apr 2021, 23:13 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
CORRECTION... I misread my tester. These old 33uf caps are only measuring around 31pf! And since they're so low, this meter (MK-168) won't display an ESR.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 15 Apr 2021, 04:28 
Hardcore fan
Hardcore fan
User avatar

Joined: 13 Aug 2018, 03:18
Posts: 1045
Has thanked: 277 times
Been thanked: 306 times
I was looking at a YAJ auction not too long ago where the description said something like "spindle life extension measures taken". In the photos, it showed the spindle disassembled. Is there some preventative (and very involved) maintenance we could be doing inside of these?
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 15 Apr 2021, 12:50 
Hardcore fan
Hardcore fan
User avatar

Joined: 03 Aug 2013, 17:32
Posts: 1426
Location: OREGON, U.S.
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 91 times
my "first" LD player was a CLD-1080 that wouldn't spin a disc.

after about 10-odd secs. of power-up, the lens barrel in the pickup would begin audibly and visibly vibrating,
and a definite, fishy foul odor began to emanate from somewhere in the chassis.

this was WAY back, -must have been around 2000/2001- so i didn't know the first thing about what might have been going on,
let alone how to possibly even begin to approach the problem...
_________________
* PIONEER CLD-3030 Compatible LDP (1988) (( http://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3094 ))
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 15 Apr 2021, 13:24 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 04:45
Posts: 35
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times
tasuke wrote:
my "first" LD player was a CLD-1080 that wouldn't spin a disc.

after about 10-odd secs. of power-up, the lens barrel in the pickup would begin audibly and visibly vibrating,
and a definite, fishy foul odor began to emanate from somewhere in the chassis.

this was WAY back, -must have been around 2000/2001- so i didn't know the first thing about what might have been going on,
let alone how to possibly even begin to approach the problem...


My guess is that as the motor is spinning, the stench from the old leaking caps inside the motor gets stirred up and blown out the openings in the motor housing. The spinning of the laserdisc contributes to blow the smell out of the machine.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CLD-M90 spins LD & CD very slowly and then stops. Burn s
PostPosted: 15 Apr 2021, 13:42 
Jedi Knight
Jedi Knight
User avatar

Joined: 14 Jan 2010, 09:44
Posts: 5161
Location: United States
Has thanked: 684 times
Been thanked: 688 times
rein-o wrote:
Wow, you are in uncharted territory.
People talk about rebuilding the spindle motor but haven't yet.
Keep up the work, I doubt it will work after all the work you do but if you succeed then others can learn from it,


Usually the issue with spindles is the bearing. I guess we have to be on the lookout for this too.
Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 Page 1 of 2 [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: