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cplusplus
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 04 Dec 2019, 00:03 |
Hardcore fan |
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Joined: 13 Aug 2018, 03:18 Posts: 1529 Has thanked: 454 times Been thanked: 592 times
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sonicboom wrote: Some people even prefer players that are LD only and don't play CDs. I don't think CD playback as a feature has much of an effect on longevity. sonicboom wrote: How long will a 25+ year old player last if you watch 1 CLV title per day? No way to really answer this. If that 25+ year old player experienced little use, it would likely last a long time. When I attempt to assess how long a player has left, it is really a question on how much life is left in the pickup for me. Signs of dropouts or digital audio distortion usually mean the pickup is weak. This can be temporarily fixed with an adjustment though. sonicboom wrote: Am I just killing my machine(s) with each spin? Yes, but the same goes for a lot of things. signofzeta wrote: The 80s industrial decks are the toughest I know of. I can’t remember the names but they all have RS232 ports, are single sided, only have analog sound, and come with giant remotes. They are usually very quiet but have a noisy picture. LD-V2200 is one. Very well made CLD-3030 chassis based player. I'm fond of the CLD-V2600 as well, but it is not as well made.
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sonicboom
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 04 Dec 2019, 16:36 |
Serious fan |
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Joined: 26 May 2014, 19:25 Posts: 236 Location: United States Has thanked: 65 times Been thanked: 92 times
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Thanks for all the suggestions - keep them coming! I have always been intrigued at industrial players since we had them in school. Owning one should be a rite of passage for me. I also like that there is EFM/RS232 ports to play with on my old Macs and for stupid projects. Also, 4300/4400 is used for Domesday so that got me thinking more about build quality. Yes, my 704 spindle motor is dead and will take me a while to do the repair (I'm scared to screw it up). I'll post here looking for help when I decide to take the plunge. Thankfully I have a few players but as we all know they're all in a state of unknown use prior to us getting them. I'm worried that I'm going to ruin the nice players and be stuck with not great machines or need to constantly be looking for a better set up. That is my fear with spending big money on something like an XO or even a R7G. Eventually those will die and I'll be bummed. Part of the fun of this hobby is the the hardware. It also is the part that sucks because it so prone to failure. The 10 sided monster was the JFK box. Sides 1-8 are the movie then the last disc is a documentary. https://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/04533/35574/JFK/Beyond-JFK:-Question-of-ConspiracyMost CAV movies are 2-3 discs so still quite a bit of RPMs. What about karaoke players? Are those somewhere between home and industrial as far as MTBF or expected life?
_________________ Kevin LD-S2|CLD-D704|CLD-D406|DVL-V888|LX-900U|Crystalio II|Yamaha APD-1|Sony XBR55X810C
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signofzeta
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 00:01 |
Jedi Knight |
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Joined: 14 Jan 2010, 09:44 Posts: 6010 Location: Ann Arbor Has thanked: 1307 times Been thanked: 1118 times
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My LDW1 broke but I fixed it with $5 worth of epoxy (and hours).
My 99 has had...I’m going to say three or four spindles. I’ve only lost one but I didn’t get it until about 6 years ago. I own or have owned 7 or 8 other decks and I don’t think any of them ever broke. Grip rings and cleanings maybe and an M Holder on my 604. I traded away by very first player, the S201, in the late 90s and it worked fine then. I actually dropped that sucker on cement from about 2’ up and it had no affect on playback. It worked in 2004 when I saw it the last time. So dropped once, used a LOT, and still lasted 12 years or more, never repaired. Seriously, how does one beat that? And that deck is basically garbage.
One thing I didn’t mention that should be obvious, decks with Both Side Play are more fragile except the W1 which is bonkers tough in every directions.
_________________ All about LD care, inner sleeves, shrink wrap, etc.
https://youtu.be/b3O-vHpHRpM
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substance
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 05:54 |
Confirmed Padawan |
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Joined: 16 May 2009, 18:05 Posts: 3593 Location: California, USA Has thanked: 29 times Been thanked: 328 times
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takeshi666 wrote: I saw an old listing in the UK where someone was selling the Theta Voyager for like a hundred pounds, about two years ago. If I'd been looking for a player then, I'd probably offered him another hundred to ship it, too.
But then, it's a transport without it's own DAC isn't it? You can listen to analog tracks if available on the disc. Digital tracks are output as bitstream only. Cosmetically it is magnificent. Nothing comes close to its beauty and built. Even the mighty HLD-X0 looks dull and small next to it. Very thick brushed aluminum everywhere. I had both silver and black versions together at one point. They are both the most beautiful disc players (among all disc player, not only LD). Inside it has the most advance power section among all disc players. The entire stock power section has been bypassed. There are 7 separate (very large) transformers. Even the servo motor and the tray motor get their own dedicated power transformer and rectifiers. All stock capacitors on the stock Pioneer boards are replaced with oversized audiophile grade capacitors. The entire video output stage is bypassed and there is a new analog output video output stage. You could buy the optional component output card which adds 480p progressive scan output. This makes it the only LD player with 480p progressive scan output. This output card uses sil501 (if I recall) which is an earlier deinterlacing chip from DVDO (ABT). Like any other Theta player, the entire stock audio section is also bypassed for the very low jitter digital audio output stage. Digital SDI output and RS-232 serial control output were other options but I have never seen any Voyager with these options installed. I asked Theta of their existence and they couldn’t confirm. Nevertheless, the core unit they used is a DVL-919 which is above average but not stellar. It is not a low noise design. Mpeg decoder for the DVD section has inherit chroma bug issues which can not be remedied with upgrades. I would say it performs better than a CLD-704 with all these upgrades.
_________________ Coming Soon Derman Labs Anything Of Substance
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takeshi666
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 12:47 |
Absolute fan |
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Joined: 01 Feb 2018, 02:41 Posts: 2001 Location: Finland Has thanked: 186 times Been thanked: 391 times
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substance wrote: takeshi666 wrote: I saw an old listing in the UK where someone was selling the Theta Voyager for like a hundred pounds, about two years ago. If I'd been looking for a player then, I'd probably offered him another hundred to ship it, too.
But then, it's a transport without it's own DAC isn't it? You can listen to analog tracks if available on the disc. Digital tracks are output as bitstream only. Coax only or does it have TOSlink?
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substance
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 15:54 |
Confirmed Padawan |
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Joined: 16 May 2009, 18:05 Posts: 3593 Location: California, USA Has thanked: 29 times Been thanked: 328 times
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takeshi666 wrote: substance wrote: takeshi666 wrote: I saw an old listing in the UK where someone was selling the Theta Voyager for like a hundred pounds, about two years ago. If I'd been looking for a player then, I'd probably offered him another hundred to ship it, too.
But then, it's a transport without it's own DAC isn't it? You can listen to analog tracks if available on the disc. Digital tracks are output as bitstream only. Coax only or does it have TOSlink? Toslink was optional add on. I have not seen any Theta units installed with this option. It must be super rare if it even exists.
_________________ Coming Soon Derman Labs Anything Of Substance
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sonicboom
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Post subject: Re: Which players are the most reliable or mechanically soun Posted: 05 Dec 2019, 16:57 |
Serious fan |
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Joined: 26 May 2014, 19:25 Posts: 236 Location: United States Has thanked: 65 times Been thanked: 92 times
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signofzeta wrote: Most karaoke players are just consumer decks. Most of them anyway. I'm hoping the v888 lasts a while..... signofzeta wrote: If you want to fix your 704 some day then start looking for spindles now. I have a 702 that has cracked gear teeth so I plan on using its motor in the 704. I may have questions for you in the future... signofzeta wrote: Also, I personally don’t consider LD players unreliable. The sheer number of moving parts, many of them old/thin/fragile plastic and the unknown treatment and use is what I'm talking about. As mentioned previously, all 12cm media requires so much less power to spin them. I think dust and heat kill the PS3s. Just abused really. substance wrote: You also have to keep in mind and be able to identify a high end player from a hype end player. This kinda got off topic into PQ and high end players. Really just asking about mechanical superiority. I'm not the kind of person who'd every buy a Theta. I'd be fine with the 919 if it was in decent shape. Also, to someone's point, PQ is largely determined by whatever processing you're using these days be it an external processor or just the TV processing. PQ is not a concern right now. I had read here, somewhere, that the XO and perhaps another industrial player used a solid metal rail instead of a loading belt or something along those lines. I seem to remember seeing photos of the S1 and/or X1 that had a solid copper honeycomb base for stability...those are things I'm interested in. Build quality, stability, longevity and reliability. These are all design features at heart. The best players have the best design for mechanical layout and workflow. X0, X1, S1 are all pretty solidly built compared to a 704. For example, there are several types of side flipping systems (Alpha, Gamma, Epsilon). Some players have a door in front of the drawer (that often sticks or breaks). Not only do I want to know what's best, let's hear which players SUCK in this regard. Which players are constantly breaking due to a design flaw or a cheap/poorly made part (like the M Holder thing). Another example is the 704/99 series has spindle issues. The X9 has a cheap tray that breaks...
_________________ Kevin LD-S2|CLD-D704|CLD-D406|DVL-V888|LX-900U|Crystalio II|Yamaha APD-1|Sony XBR55X810C
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