Unaltered Original Star Wars Trilogy on Blu-ray

sdraper · Posted: 19 Aug 2014, 20:13

bguzman wrote:

sdraper wrote:

The originals were never reissued. On DVD we got a higher-res copy of the master for the 1993 Definitive Collection LD, complete with the godawful motion smearing DVNR of the time.
I doubt this news as there have always been rumors, but don't rule out the possibility of it ever happening.
If a boutique label like Criterion or an Archive label get to do a one-off OT release that would be the only way we might get a true fan release.
Disc 1: 35mm general release with
-1977 Dolby Stereo
-1977 Academy mono
-1985 Home video Dolby remix
Seamlessly branched with the 70mm version and featuring a recreation of the six track Dolby mix in 4.1 or 4.2
Disc 2-35mm ESB with Dolby Stereo, Mono and the 70mm version with its few differences
Disc 3-ROTJ with Dolby Stereo and 70mm track.

That would be freakin' awesome, you're hired. :clap:

I know right? They wouldn't even have to pay me, just a place to work and rarely sleep.

substance · Posted: 20 Aug 2014, 02:06

I hope they wait till 4K and dolby atmos/dts-uhd to settle. I dont want to quadriple dip. But knowing how it goes, it will likely be..

First release 1080p bd with dts-hd ma or dolby truehd
Second releass 1080p with dolby atmos or dts-uhd
Third release 4k with dolby atmos or dts-uhd

They might squeeze in a 3d release as well but it wouldnt interest me. Also I dont if disney is going to follow the vault system for these releases so they are always going to be expensive and even more expensive used marjet once disney vaults them.

signofzeta · Posted: 20 Aug 2014, 20:22

sdraper wrote:

The originals were never reissued. On DVD we got a higher-res copy of the master for the 1993 Definitive Collection LD, complete with the godawful motion smearing DVNR of the time.
I doubt this news as there have always been rumors, but don't rule out the possibility of it ever happening.
If a boutique label like Criterion or an Archive label get to do a one-off OT release that would be the only way we might get a true fan release.
Disc 1: 35mm general release with
-1977 Dolby Stereo
-1977 Academy mono
-1985 Home video Dolby remix
Seamlessly branched with the 70mm version and featuring a recreation of the six track Dolby mix in 4.1 or 4.2
Disc 2-35mm ESB with Dolby Stereo, Mono and the 70mm version with its few differences
Disc 3-ROTJ with Dolby Stereo and 70mm track.

That's just...nuts. Nobody cares about all that crap. You actually expect Disney to spend man hours preparing a mono mix? Why? Who would listen to it and why? I saw Star Wars in the theater as a kid (twice, ducked behind the seats until they started it up again) and a crazy number of times since then, and I'm not sure I've ever actually seen the movie in mono. It's just not a mono sort of film, and the mono mix was obviously created for...I suppose inferior formats like 16mm, VHS, UHF, etc, formats that can only be considered substandard. So why would I care about mono? Do you want a pan and scan version dubbed into French too? How about a version edited for TV?

This kind of insanity just makes it obvious that it's literally impossible to satisfy obsessed fans. Those features would take many tens of thousands of dollars to produce in addition to an already expensive restoration and %99.9 of buyers would never select them once or even understand what they are.

Realistically, seriously, I'm 41 years old and I'll probably only watch Star Wars three or four more times before I croak. I don't need 11 versions of the movie. Do I want a very good original version of the series? Yes. Do I want to play Blurays in Dolby Surround? No. Absolutely not. They can do whatever they want with the sound as long as they don't replace or remove FX or music. I don't care.

substance · Posted: 20 Aug 2014, 22:00

I heard there is a turkish dubbed version on pal betamax. I want that too

hauntmedoitagain · Posted: 20 Aug 2014, 23:50

None of the original Star Wars films were ever theatrically presented in mono, anyway. It was always 70mm 6-track or Dolby Stereo depending on if the print was 70mm or 35mm.

sdraper · Posted: 24 Aug 2014, 23:29

Disney doesn't have to do anything. LFL has the mixes digitally archived already as was evidenced in the video behind the scenes for the creation of the atrocious new BD 6.1 remix. The mono mix for the first film is actually quite different and despite the limitations has come to be my favorite mix. And I love huge dynamic multichannel audio. The mono was the final shot done by Ben Burtt and Lucas while the other versions were already taking the world by storm. It was their final effort for posterity.

bguzman · Posted: 25 Aug 2014, 04:15

sdraper wrote:

Disney doesn't have to do anything. LFL has the mixes digitally archived already as was evidenced in the video behind the scenes for the creation of the atrocious new BD 6.1 remix. The mono mix for the first film is actually quite different and despite the limitations has come to be my favorite mix. And I love huge dynamic multichannel audio. The mono was the final shot done by Ben Burtt and Lucas while the other versions were already taking the world by storm. It was their final effort for posterity.

Where and how do I locate this mono score?

And no, it is not a Korean VCD. :lolno:

brazos · Posted: 25 Aug 2014, 05:04

signofzeta wrote:

Realistically, seriously, I'm 41 years old and I'll probably only watch Star Wars three or four more times before I croak.

Really? I'm about your age, and my wife and I watch the original trilogy at least once a year (my Definitive Edition box set, of course). Looking forward to when I can watch it with my 8-month old when he's old enough. Not sure I'd watch it with the mono soundtrack though. ; )

acuozzo · Posted: 02 Sep 2014, 23:54

hauntmedoitagain wrote:

None of the original Star Wars films were ever theatrically presented in mono, anyway. It was always 70mm 6-track or Dolby Stereo depending on if the print was 70mm or 35mm.

This is incorrect. Most 35mm theatrical presentations of Star Wars during its initial run used the mono mix. This mix is not a fold-down and, as sdraper said, contains a significant number of differences.

Star Wars Sound Mixes: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic. ... Post628663
Star Wars Mono Mix Guide: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/russdawson/mono/

acuozzo · Posted: 02 Sep 2014, 23:57

bguzman wrote:

Where and how do I locate this mono score?

Usenet (alt.binaries.starwars). Belbucus from originaltrilogy.com led the restoration: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic. ... opic/7222/

Alternatively, it's present on Harmy's Star Wars Despecialized Edition as an alternate audio track.

acuozzo · Posted: 03 Sep 2014, 00:00

signofzeta wrote:

So why would I care about mono?

Because it's how most people heard the film during its initial theatrical run. It's also the mix that George&co. spent the most time preparing.

Quote:

After completing the multi-channel versions for the first prints, the sound editors created yet another mix, a single-channel monaural track. This mix was to be included on prints destined for theatres not equipped with stereo sound systems, and for ancillary markets. While the mono mix could have been created from the Dolby Stereo master by "folding" the tracks into one, instead the team decided to create a new dedicated mono mix from scratch.

At the time, the extended life of a film was played out through television broadcasts. It was thought that long after the film had disappeared from the big screen, this was how it would be remembered, and it seemed logical to refine the mix to this end for archival concerns. Thus, the editors took the opportunity to revise and enhance selected portions of the soundtrack. Sound designer Ben Burtt recalls: "Because we were always trying to make the film better and better and fix things that were not right, there was some 'sweetening' done; things like different Stormtrooper or C-3PO lines, additional sound effects, or some different ADR."

Some members of the production felt the mono mix represented the definitive soundtrack of the movie (not in terms of a sonic experience but, rather, in terms of audio content), and felt that the multi-channel versions were a novelty that only select audiences would be treated to during a brief theatrical run. "George put a lot of effort in that mono mix," Burtt remembers, "and he even said several times, 'Well, this is the real mix. This is the definitive mix of the film.' He paid more attention to it because he felt it was more important archivally."

confederate · Posted: 03 Sep 2014, 00:46

acuozzo, thank you for your expertise input !

It seems some people claim things they do not even know !

There is a guy who made a telecine copy of the original 16mm reels and posted them online ( easy to find ) with the original mono mix !!!

signofzeta · Posted: 03 Sep 2014, 02:18

But is it better? Is it interesting to listen to for any specific reason?

sdraper · Posted: 03 Sep 2014, 18:34

IMO yes. Many dialogue, sound and music differences exist in the mono mix, and a great number of these found their way into the 1997 SE 5.1 remix. The score has a greater level of involvement and placement to boot. Of course it is Academy mono so it is technically and spatially limited--but is such a well done effect that it provides for an interesting alternate. And then there are crazy people like me who grow to prefer it despite not being as robust at the discrete versions.

Never did I think a mono track could outdo Jaws in terms of sound design, effects and overall ambiance. This does.

acuozzo · Posted: 04 Sep 2014, 00:16

signofzeta wrote:

But is it better? Is it interesting to listen to for any specific reason?

What sdraper said. 8-)

bguzman · Posted: 04 Sep 2014, 05:25

sdraper wrote:

IMO yes. Many dialogue, sound and music differences exist in the mono mix, and a great number of these found their way into the 1997 SE 5.1 remix. The score has a greater level of involvement and placement to boot. Of course it is Academy mono so it is technically and spatially limited--but is such a well done effect that it provides for an interesting alternate. And then there are crazy people like me who grow to prefer it despite not being as robust at the discrete versions.

Never did I think a mono track could outdo Jaws in terms of sound design, effects and overall ambiance. This does.

The good thing about the Jaws BD is that they included a DTS mono mix. :thumbup:

bguzman · Posted: 04 Sep 2014, 05:28

acuozzo wrote:

bguzman wrote:

Where and how do I locate this mono score?

Usenet (alt.binaries.starwars). Belbucus from originaltrilogy.com led the restoration: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic. ... opic/7222/

Alternatively, it's present on Harmy's Star Wars Despecialized Edition as an alternate audio track.

Thanks acuzzo, I have the latest 2.5 edition of that so that is good to know.

ertoili · Posted: 09 Oct 2014, 10:23

Unaltered analogic film on Digital mpg-4...??? how is that ?

I think even a LD-rip made with direct-pure mode link to a DVD Recorder is more "unaltered"
than re-create the whole film to a clean 1080p BD

Is Michael Bay and Professor Falken the same person ? i knew it !!

nissling · Posted: 09 Oct 2014, 14:54

ertoili wrote:

Unaltered analogic film on Digital mpg-4...??? how is that ?

I think even a LD-rip made with direct-pure mode link to a DVD Recorder is more "unaltered"
than re-create the whole film to a clean 1080p BD

No offense but that's just b******t. I have no idea what Blu-Ray player you're using but if you get worse picture quality than with your Laserdisc player you should honestly reclaim it asap.

ertoili · Posted: 10 Oct 2014, 16:17

Post is "unaltered" for "Celuloid on Bluray recreation"....DVD proved it is not capable(Hue,color accuracy,etc..), i think Bluray can almost do it "Vertigo"BD (Hitchcock) is a great example but still too digital imho....you can accept the original movie is not clean ,has no color saturation and no way 1080 resolution... or digitally process it to create an amazing background detailed and clean BD....choose what you prefer, but the reviews of SW on BD and DVD till date talk about different colors....I read somewhere that Lucasfilm tried to use the Masters of Laserdiscs to make some DVD edition and even with that the results were different

Unaltered Original Star Wars Trilogy on Blu-ray

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