It is currently 06 Aug 2020, 20:09




 Page 5 of 6 [ 108 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 13:48 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

You're saying whatsoever. LD were about 150Fr , 20€. Today it's about 30€.
Also for the ones who think that the LD is not RGB:
http://hpics.li/1e101ef

Rgds,
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 13:57 
Absolute fan
Absolute fan
User avatar

Joined: 24 Jun 2010, 10:23
Posts: 1629
Location: Sweden
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 50 times
I don't get it. The CXA-1645 is a chroma encoder, used in i.e. the Sega Saturn. Why would a Laserdisc player have it? There's no reason to encode the colors from a Laserdisc since they're already encoded.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 14:04 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

Here learn:
http://hpics.li/38fe6a0
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/91110 ... -D925.html

Rgd,
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 14:17 
Absolute fan
Absolute fan
User avatar

Joined: 24 Jun 2010, 10:23
Posts: 1629
Location: Sweden
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 50 times
The red, green and blue channel are compressed within a composite carrier, therefore it's composite. Isn't that obvious?
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 14:53 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

They choose to do like this because the modulated signal in alone. If they stored the composant in 3 signals, the problem won't occur. They limited the number of carrier as one for all the video, one for the audio.

Rgds,
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 14:57 
Jedi Master
Jedi Master
User avatar

Joined: 03 May 2004, 19:05
Posts: 6572
Location: United States
Has thanked: 334 times
Been thanked: 278 times
WOW this is up to 5 pages :yawn:
This is NOT going to happen no matter what.
The risk is not worth it, unless you have an unlimited amount of money then stop posting and start making new LDs :|

I think this topic needs to be locked :wave:
Online
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 15:26 
Absolute fan
Absolute fan
User avatar

Joined: 24 Jun 2010, 10:23
Posts: 1629
Location: Sweden
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 50 times
anonyme-x22 wrote:
They limited the number of carrier as one for all the video

And therefore it's composite and not RGB. Nor has it ever been the latter.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 16:05 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

Composite only means that one signal have all the data!
That's why i can agree with the electrical huge compressing of the signal, but it's totally different from the data loss from the heavy compression of the digital.

Remember, nothing is loss in analog -> composite separated = RGB + Brigthness.
Isn't it unbelievable, one signal which can give 4 ones. And the only issue is signal separation. But think that is it relative. 1V/4= 0.25Volt = small resolution. 10/4=25V ....

Ps: Using the SVHS ouput, will give you better results as component out, because of the inside separation of the brigthness and colour. Today analog filter are too bad on LCD and so on...

PS2: In the futur, all the people who won't want be augmented will worth nothing!
PS3: In art, we quite always prefer what's in life than what's dead.

Rgds,
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 17:14 
Absolute fan
Absolute fan
User avatar

Joined: 24 Jun 2010, 10:23
Posts: 1629
Location: Sweden
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 50 times
anonyme-x22 wrote:
Remember, nothing is loss in analog -> composite separated = RGB + Brigthness.
Isn't it unbelievable, one signal which can give 4 ones. And the only issue is signal separation. But think that is it relative. 1V/4= 0.25Volt = small resolution. 10/4=25V ....

You're playing with fate. Much is lost in composite, the bandwidth for chroma is highly reduced and cannot be gained with its final product. Besides, RGB doesn't need any external luma carrier since everything is in the three channels. Sync is needed but it doesn't contain any actual information, it's just there to keep the channels together etc.

anonyme-x22 wrote:
PS3: In art, we quite always prefer what's in life than what's dead.

In art, it's all about how something is supposed to look and not what you as a consumer wants to perceive. Put a blue light in the face of Mona Lisa and you will not look at Da Vinci's work. A Laserdisc has absolutely nothing in common with a 35mm IP or print. That's a fact.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 17:24 
True fan
True fan
User avatar

Joined: 08 Jan 2013, 18:13
Posts: 333
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 4 times
anonyme-x22 wrote:
composite separated = RGB + Brigthness

No. NTSC composite signals are composed of three separate channels: Y, I, and Q.

YIQ is not RGB.

Please learn about colorspaces before talking further.

Separating an NTSC composite signal into YIQ is the job of a comb filter and it's a lossy process that attempts to make use of standardized phase relationships to reduce error due to interference cause by chroma modulation during encoding.

anonyme-x22 wrote:
nothing is loss in analog

Loss relative to what?

Loss occurs at every single stage of LD production.

    1. 35mm -> Master tape: Loss.
    2. Master tape -> LD master: Loss.
    3. LD master -> LD pressing: Loss.
    4. LD pressing -> LD player: Loss.
    5. LD player -> TV: Loss.
    6. TV -> your eyes: Loss.

With digital you only get loss from #1 and #6.

anonyme-x22 wrote:
Ps: Using the SVHS ouput, will give you better results as component out, because of the inside separation of the brigthness and colour. Today analog filter are too bad on LCD and so on...

No. Laserdisc video is a composite signal. S-video output requires a comb filter and the comb filter in every single LD player (including the late generation NEC ones) is crap by modern standards. You'll get better results using an ADV7842 for comb filtering.
_________________
Fill my eyes with that DiscoVision!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 17:34 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

Quote:
You're playing with fate. Much is lost in composite, the bandwidth for chroma is highly reduced and cannot be gained with its final product. Besides, RGB doesn't need any external luma carrier since everything is in the three channels. Sync is needed but it doesn't contain any actual information, it's just there to keep the channels together etc.


Did you do test to prove that the electrical compression result in data loss!.
I can just tell you that the oversampling in the signal from the laserdisc is *8. So rapidly 0.75V*8=6V. you have an effective resolution of 6V per color.
What if we add 1 carrier per component!

Quote:
In art, it's all about how something is supposed to look and not what you as a consumer wants to perceive. Put a blue light in the face of Mona Lisa and you will not look at Da Vinci's work. A Laserdisc has absolutely nothing in common with a 35mm IP or print. That's a fact.


So what, the only common things with the 35mm is that all the pictures are present and, so what ?

Quote:
No. NTSC composite signals are composed of three separate channels: Y, I, and Q.


Sorry , i wasn't talking of NTSC, but PAL.

Quote:
Loss relative to what?

Loss occurs at every single stage of LD production.

1. 35mm -> Master tape: Loss.
2. Master tape -> LD master: Loss.
3. LD master -> LD pressing: Loss.
4. LD pressing -> LD player: Loss.
5. LD player -> TV: Loss.
6. TV -> your eyes: Loss.


With digital you only get loss from #1 and #6.


So what ?

Quote:
No. Laserdisc video is a composite signal. S-video output requires a comb filter and the comb filter in every single LD player (including the late generation NEC ones) is crap by modern standards. You'll get better results using an ADV7842 for comb filtering.


Please read the cld d925 manual! Tested the component and s-vhs. Constated more brigthness, sharpness, and less contour ghosting. Nice device 'ADV7842', yep it should improve the overall ouptut for sure.

Rgds,

Ps: i sworm that when my time will come, i won't dead like a society puppet.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 17:46 
Young Padawan
Young Padawan
User avatar

Joined: 16 May 2009, 18:05
Posts: 3229
Location: Orange County, CA
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 116 times
Julien please close this thread:) I will donate $50!!
_________________
Wanted
HD-VMD Discs
Hi-Vision/Muse Discs Only complete/mint!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 17:56 
True fan
True fan
User avatar

Joined: 08 Jan 2013, 18:13
Posts: 333
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 4 times
anonyme-x22 wrote:
So what ?

You wrote that with analog there is no loss. This is not true. With Laserdisc loss results from every stage of production.

Please pay attention to what you write in your posts.

anonyme-x22 wrote:
Please read the cld d925 manual! Tested the component and s-vhs. Constated more brigthness, sharpness, and less contour ghosting. Nice device 'ADV7842', yep it should improve the overall ouptut for sure.

So? It's still going through an internal comb filter and doing a matrix transform after the fact to provide RGB.

And you know what? That comb filter in your CLD-D925 is DIGITAL and it uses DIGITAL SAMPLES like everything else.

anonyme-x22 wrote:
Ps: i sworm that when my time will come, i won't dead like a society puppet.

Look at you! So cool. Leader of the Laserdisc Revolution. You've figured out things about Laserdisc that even the engineers responsible for designing the format didn't know. You've uncovered the hidden truth. Everyone else is a society puppet with their digital this and Blu-ray that. Who needs digital when you can have the power of ANALOG?! Infinite samples. Infinite colors. Infinite infinities, infinitely.
_________________
Fill my eyes with that DiscoVision!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 17:58 
True fan
True fan
User avatar

Joined: 08 Jan 2013, 18:13
Posts: 333
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 4 times
forper wrote:
You're just another tech guy who thinks with his head, not his heart.

Just like the engineers responsible for the Laserdisc format, right?
_________________
Fill my eyes with that DiscoVision!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 18:07 
Young Padawan
Young Padawan
User avatar

Joined: 16 May 2009, 18:05
Posts: 3229
Location: Orange County, CA
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 116 times
acuozzo wrote:
forper wrote:
You're just another tech guy who thinks with his head, not his heart.

Just like the engineers responsible for the Laserdisc format, right?


he should beat my $50 donation offer (in order to close this thread) to Julien first. Show us how serious you are, analog guys!! 100 million will come for sure, lets see if you can keep this forum alive with a few bucks.
_________________
Wanted
HD-VMD Discs
Hi-Vision/Muse Discs Only complete/mint!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 18:28 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

Quote:
You wrote that with analog there is no loss. This is not true. With Laserdisc loss results from every stage of production.

Please pay attention to what you write in your posts.


I've got an audio amplifier which have a loss of 75%, and you don't even image, loss of power, loss of heat, loss of space, gain :) of noise, etc..., but it sounds terribly better that 99% of the audio amplifier whose have a loss of 25%. In fact you cannot have a better sound with any other amplifier of today at less than 20000$. Does i'm rich, no because i won't be hear to heard your insult on a poor guy, which love LD, and wants to be able to play with them for life. If i add the money, you're already got new Lds. I'm informed.

When men start to play on the words....

Quote:
Look at you! So cool. Leader of the Laserdisc Revolution. You've figured out things about Laserdisc that even the engineers responsible for designing the format didn't know. You've uncovered the hidden truth. Everyone else is a society puppet with their digital this and Blu-ray that. Who needs digital when you can have the power of ANALOG?! Infinite samples. Infinite colors. Infinite infinities, infinitely.


Pioneer has been doing player till end of 2013 because of course, Laserdisc was obsolete till 1990...

You are guys whose don't seems to have any love in LD, but in technologies. I'm impressed that such guys like you can have so many power. But so as the boss....
What about a 2CV, if i tell you that i got one, when i take it, i have more pleasure because of it's defect than taking a self automated car.

You are so .... i don't know what, that you request censorship on a forum, more than that on a thread which is showing ardor and passion on the main subject of this same forum!!!!!!!

Rgds,
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 18:56 
Young Padawan
Young Padawan
User avatar

Joined: 16 May 2009, 18:05
Posts: 3229
Location: Orange County, CA
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 116 times
I think you should first upgrade your English translator. I don't understand half of what you say.
_________________
Wanted
HD-VMD Discs
Hi-Vision/Muse Discs Only complete/mint!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 19:06 
True fan
True fan
User avatar

Joined: 08 Jan 2013, 18:13
Posts: 333
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 4 times
anonyme-x22 wrote:
that you request censorship on a forum

I didn't request censorship. I asked you to pay attention to what you write in your posts because you seem to not remember what you write in them and then write "So what?" when someone replies directly to a particular statement you've made.

anonyme-x22 wrote:
You are guys whose don't seems to have any love in LD, but in technologies.

I have no love for LD? What does this room say to you?

Image
(I'm sorry for the bad pic.)

I just have realistic expectations and I know enough broadcast engineering to realize that while Laserdisc has earned its role in history, it has been far, far surpassed by subsequent home video formats in most respects.


Last edited by acuozzo on 03 Oct 2016, 19:16, edited 2 times in total. _________________
Fill my eyes with that DiscoVision!
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 19:14 
Genuinely interested
Genuinely interested
User avatar

Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 17:02
Posts: 42
Location: France
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time
Hi,

Quote:
Julien please close this thread:) I will donate $50!!


to acuozzo:
Very impressive, keep on fighting, i have the heart full of joy imagining having this!
so why don't you want new ones ?

Here what i got:
http://hpics.li/5daf16f

Continues thinking like this, and after your death, which i hope won't come, because you're the best if anything you have is put to trash.
I won't ever be able to have the quarter you have.
I'm young LD lover, and want to have a lot, but not only the ones i will still you :), but the new ones i will bought with pleasure to have them in my collection, as i'm loving having new vinyl whose if there're scratched, it will be my fault, not the other who had it before fault.

Rgds,
Ps: As it doesn't mean anything to you, you won't mind if i give you my collection of blue s... and you give me the ld one you got. :clap:


Last edited by anonyme-x22 on 03 Oct 2016, 19:30, edited 6 times in total.
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Project Laserdisc reawakening
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 19:21 
True fan
True fan
User avatar

Joined: 08 Jan 2013, 18:13
Posts: 333
Location: United States
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 4 times
anonyme-x22 wrote:
Very impressive, keep on fighting, i'm full of joy imagining having this!so why don't you want new ones ?

I never said I don't. I only replied to very specific statements made in this thread.

I think your goal is fine and I hope you can achieve it—good luck!
_________________
Fill my eyes with that DiscoVision!
Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 Page 5 of 6 [ 108 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: