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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 01 Sep 2019, 21:32 
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pokefraker wrote:
That or I'll trade them for the Twin Peaks Laserdiscs.

I'd imagine they're worth more than that!

Well, unless The Visual Soundtrack is included, then it might be worth it.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 05:18 
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Small update, but I've confirmed with someone who used to use these back in the 90's, and the "test" screen does confirm that they are blank. I feel like I'm getting a bit deeper into this rabbit hole than I had originally planned.

Here's a transcription of the conversation we had, and some more information.


Hey, haven't seen one of these in a while. Here's what I know!

In the 1990's, my father ran a video production business that specialized in weddings and trials, most of which wanted VHS copies of their stuff. A few did want Laserdisc, so he'd farm that out to this same company, "Laser Disc Recording Center" in Cambridge Massachusetts. The discs were all made by the "Optical Disc Corporation" out of Santa Fe Springs California. I was a kid at the time, but I'd estimate 100 or so of these discs passed through there. Both businesses folded sometime after the new millennium- my father's last filled recordable laser disc order was in 2003. If there had been a "prosumer" Laser Disc recorder available, I'm sure my father would have bought it, so I rather doubt there were any out there. He did say/brag that 'they' (the people who recorded the laserdiscs) were using the same system he was for S/VHS, the Amiga 4000T with NewTek's video toaster 4000- which was one of the top-of-the-line ways to handle analog video back in the day, so I wouldn't doubt it. The equipment these guys were using is still out there, somewhere, and it would be a great boost to the Laserdisc community/fandom if there were some way to get our hands on them as a service again. But short of getting the specialized equipment, or a time machine back to the 1990's, I don't know if there is a way to take those rare disks and make them into the most valuable treasure on earth. The Star Wars Holiday Special on Laserdisc... that would be beyond incredible.

Interestingly, some of the "single" sided disks have a silver "dimpled" pattern on the "blank" side. This leads me to believe that whatever media they're using to record on (the ruby stuff) is the most expensive component of making these recordable disks. I've no proof of that, but I can't think of why they'd leave a side basically blank like this.

Pictures:
Case: Image
Disk (side A): Image
Disk (side B): Image

I'll keep my eyes open, and do some sleuthing. If I ever can get my hands on the means to record one of these things, you'll be the first to know.



I followed up by asking if he knew how to tell if the discs were blank, or of they could have multiple writes.


I'm not really sure about rewriting them- the process by which these were made suggests that there might have been a way to erase a disk to then write a fresh analog signal, but I have no idea what sort of equipment you might need to achieve that, or what the results might be. Again, I'm not entirely sure on that one.

As for "are they actually blank" I took your pictures and showed them to my father. He said that that's the "blank" signal from ODC to verify the disk is good, and ready to be recorded to. You, my lucky friend, likely have some of the last blank RLV disks out there!

A bit more info he provided; the service Laser Disc Recording Center provided (he called it 'mastering' but I'm not sure that that's the right term) cost about $100 per disk, going all the way back to the mid 1990's. He said the only people that wanted Laserdiscs made were attorneys and insurance companies involved in big-ticket lawsuits he was hired to film depositions for, and they gladly paid the fees for them. He said he averaged about 10 disks a year until DVD came around.

The hunt for a machine that'll make RLV's continues. Again, if I find anything, you'll be the first to know!
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 10:51 
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fascinating, thanks for posting that.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 13:42 
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well, that's certainly more affordable than the $1000.00-per-30-minute-recordable-disk of PIONEER's RLV system...
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 18:17 
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That’s a lot of new info, at least to me.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 21:07 
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Looks like they were still doing glass masters in 2001:
https://forums.creativecow.net/archivethread/4/75237
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 22:03 
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signofzeta wrote:
That’s a lot of new info, at least to me.



Yeah it's crazy how little information exists for these things.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2019, 22:12 
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pokefraker wrote:
signofzeta wrote:
That’s a lot of new info, at least to me.



Yeah it's crazy how little information exists for these things.

Not really, it was too expensive for people back in the day as a hobby or even people to order a copy.

And all the people died off that knew stuff.

In reality you are lucky that this guy in his 40s or 50s is able to ask his dad questions and that he remembers stuff being 70 or 80 now.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 01:05 
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Weren't there three recordable laserdisc formats in total? There was the Editdroid one, this and that cartridge based one.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 02:38 
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Not sure how many recordable LD formats there were but here is something from my archive.

It's about the Pioneer, VDR-V1000, Magneto Optical Recorder that uses a cardtridge system. It appears similar in concept to MiniDisc.


Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image


Enjoy :)
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 05:50 
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Awesome info! That does function a lot like a Minidisc Recorder, with the heat and specific "magnet proof" benefits listed.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 06:56 
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Seriously cool,
Bet your laughing with happiness that you own a rare slice of recordable media history for only $8.
Would be a epic thing indeed if can record into it!
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 14:34 
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Yeah even with nothing on them a totally awesome buy for $8. A unique part of LD history.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 14:50 
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So it DOES record component video. Technology Connections guessed the cartridge version might utilize component video based on the name, but this pamphlet pretty much proves it.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 03 Sep 2019, 17:18 
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Is there any where we can compile this information? Maybe update the Wikipedia page since there seems to be some inaccuracies in the recordable Laserdisc section?
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 04 Sep 2019, 08:57 
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Certainly the wiki should be updated.
OP please keep us updated , your a lucky human
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 04 Sep 2019, 10:36 
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jakeheke wrote:
Certainly the wiki should be updated.
OP please keep us updated , your a lucky human


Between this, and Song of the South sealed for $3, I'm certainly lucky with Laserdiscs at the very least.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 06 Sep 2019, 19:01 
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I'll chime in, haven't posted here in quite awhile. The recordable standalone units like the VDR-V1000 of course were not really laserdisc recorders. They had a similar 12" disc inside a plastic caddy, some were write once media, some like the Pioneer had a rewritable disc and yes they were like 1000 plus dollars a disc. The machine was 30 plus thousand or something when it came out back in early 90's. But sadly, they can only record onto their own discs and can't be played back on any other players.

I still have 2 of the VDR machines packed away in garage and 2 discs but I've never hooked up a screen or video feed into it. I know one of them worked and I played around with it for awhile and think I figured out how it worked but never proceeded any further with it. It uses BNC inputs for video has xlr's for audio. Pretty hi-tech for the day. Records 32mins analog video/digital audio.

Some things to consider on recording onto RLV discs. Even if you found that big 610 recorder sitting in a warehouse somewhere. Would it even work and who would know how to run it, perform system test, maintenance etc.? There's a limited supply of discs, I have a few. What's the disc quality after all these years? Most likely the discs are bad. I can tell you from doing a HD-DVD master that you'll run into problems. I know I did with HD DVD and that tech was less than 10 years old when I burned a HD-DVD (which worked flawlessly BTW). But it was a bumpy road getting there and I wasted a number of discs in the process before I got there.

But, the likely reality is those few machines they made were scrapped 10 or 15 years ago and all that remains is some brief info online, maybe someone who worked for one of those few companies, their memories and the RLV blanks. And if you're really lucky you'll run into an RLV that has something recorded on it. I missed out on a 30 min. recording of Hondo in 3D. It was a special disc made out in California (I saved some of the pics that were up on eBay at the time.) Anyway, I forgot about the listing and missed the chance to bid. I don't think it even sold for that much. It was only a 30 min segment but still to this day they haven't released it on Blu ray 3D. And 30 mins. isn't a lot of recording time.

The closest you could come to recording onto LD would be the Pioneer VDR machine, but it's not really laserdisc. Can only play/record on that machine and with those discs, which are even harder to find than blank RLV discs. Sort of like a Betamax machine. And it's the only one worth messing with since it's rewritable. The wright once machines don't even bother.

It would be far easier/more likely to design/build a 12" HD/UHD disc with a new player, (insert crowd sourcing link here :lol: ) than it would to build a laserdisc recording studio. Getting funding to restart laserdisc production is a dead end and a major step backwards in design. No major movie studio would want to release on it because of the analog limitation and sub-SD quality recording. And the packaging size, it's hard enough to get BD's distributed when everyone is streaming these days, let alone a bigger package. Yes, LP's have made a comeback but the recording process is much cheaper. But also look at how much they cost too. So much more packaging and artwork. A 12" digital UHD disc would be a better path forward. Laserdisc 2.0 with capacity of 1TB/side. Problem is the 5" disc has become standard since CD/DVD and they keep finding ways to improve without going larger. But in this case maybe make it larger purely for nostalgic reasons and packaging/artwork. Yeah, time for a funding campaign.

-These are cool brochures I hadn't seen them before. :thumbup:
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 06 Sep 2019, 21:32 
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tomtastic wrote:
I missed out on a 30 min. recording of Hondo in 3D. It was a special disc made out in California (I saved some of the pics that were up on eBay at the time.) Anyway, I forgot about the listing and missed the chance to bid. I don't think it even sold for that much. It was only a 30 min segment but still to this day they haven't released it on Blu ray 3D. And 30 mins. isn't a lot of recording time.


I too missed out on those, I think I found them after or saw one go high and the others cheaper?
They had about 3 or so and sold them all, or that's what the seller told me.
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 Post subject: Re: Help with newly aquired RLV Discs?
PostPosted: 07 Sep 2019, 02:23 
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Yeah, that sounds about right, it was over 5 years ago so my memory could be off. I know I pulled the images from the listing at the time, have to find them. I don't recall the final price, but I had planed on bidding but I forgot about it and missed it. If it went too high I would have dropped out anyway. Since it's only 30mins and not the complete film as well as anaglyph 3D.
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