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 Post subject: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced with
PostPosted: 16 Dec 2019, 23:58 
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Favorite to most disliked.
It can be their current standings, or you can take a broader look, incorporating how much you used to enjoy VHS or Betamax or whatever format you'd no longer revisit.
Again, home media (no theaters) and hard copy (no streaming or downloads).

If you're not familiar with something older but pretty sure it wouldn't be worth your time (CED, Beta, etc) feel free to include it at your own discretion.
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 02:39 
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Laserdisc: the best. Starts right up, no copy protection, random access, killer sound, beautiful packaging, very good video for the time. Not the best video quality (now) but the most enjoyable to use format by a mile for me. I still watch LD almost every day.

BlueRay: Once it gets going it’s the best ever but the FBI warnings and commentary disclaimers make US releases infuriating. Japan releases...seem to start right up. Go figure...

VHS and DVD: I spent a lot of time on these formats but I’m not a fan of either. VHS just because it’s tape (wears out, no random access) and DVD because it looks worse than it should and of course all the animated menus and stuff so horrible they make Blu-ray seem like a breath of fresh air. And...regions. Macrovison. So sad...

CED and VCD: terrible. Terrible because they were inferior to formats already released years before, wasting people’s time. VCDs strength was only revealed when it became %99.999 pirated releases.

I don’t have a lot of experience with the other stuff.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 07:18 
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Video Quality:
How did it compare at its launch: up to 5 points
How did it compare at its retirement: up to 5 points

Audio Quality:
How did it compare at its launch: up to 5 points
How did it compare at its retirement: up to 5 points

Content:
Number of titles: up to 5 points
Market penetration: up to 5 points

Packaging:
Package Sturdiness: up to 3 points
Package on Standard releases: up to 3 points
Packaging on Box Sets, Limited and Special Editions: up to 4 points



Laserdiscs:

Video Quality: 9/10
It saturated the existing display technology of the time. It didn’t require a new breed of higher resolution displays but LD had video information for every megahertz bandwidth for your TV. Kept itself well up to date with introduction or letterboxed releases and Squeezed (Anamorphic) releases although only a handful were released.

Audio Quality: 10/10
It had digital audio before any digital music disc format. Analog tracks are still comparable to today’s standards. Kept itself well up to date with additions of AC-3, DTS and Dolby Surround EX. It could potentially have up to 4 separate audio language tracks. It’s audio potential was well realized and utilized for the most part with vast number of AC-3 releases and commentary tracks.

Content: 5/10
LD had a massive library of content but very poor market penetration.

Packaging: 8/10
jackets are easy to damage. They don’t age well unless kept in museum conditions. Also not entirely clear they protect the discs from rot and handling damage. They are visually stunning and most pleasing. Perhaps the only format you may want to collect even if you don’t care to watch the content.

Total: 32/40

D-Theater:

Video Quality: 9/10
Excellent video. Easily watchable today even on 8K TVs. There was nothing remotely close to its video quality during its entire run.(although very short).

Audio Quality: 9/10
Covered all of the major audio formats of its time. Although it could technically support it, there were never any commentary tracks or multi language titles (loses 1 point for this)

Content: 4/10
Very small selection of about 90 films but quality releases. Later formats HD-DVD and Blu-ray had way more than 90 titles released on their release year.

Packaging: 6/10
Very sturdy packaging, nice choice of theatrical posters on the cover arts for almost all releases. Literally zero box sets, special and limited edition packaging.

Total: 28/40

DVD:

Video Quality: 7/10
Only slightly better picture than LDs and significantly behind of later newer formats. Nevertheless digital video was considered remarkable and a technical achievement on the release.

Audio Quality: 6/10
It supported all audio formats of the time on release but significantly behind of later newer formats. Although it could technically have 5.1 in PCM but this was rarely utilized if ever.

Content: 10/10
Largest content library and the largest market share only rivaled by VHS.

Packaging: 8/10
Although it scored the same as LD, points came from Sturdiness and Collector’s edition box sets.

Total: 31/40

Blu-ray:

Video Quality: 9/10
Its pixel count saturated all existing TVs. You have a 1080p TV? You have 1080 progressive pixels on this disc to cover them all.

Audio Quality: 10/10
Supports every single audio format out there.

Content: 7/10
It has a very large library and keeps growing. Market penetration is still behind DVDs after well over 10 years.

Packaging: 8/10
Same as DVDs

Total: 34/40

4K UltraHD Blu-ray:

Video Quality: 10/10
First format you had to buy a new generation TV to be able to watch it.

Audio Quality: 10/10
Same as Blu-rays

Content: 5/10
Excellent choice of films and very good number of releases in only 3 years. Market share is likely shrinking or remains the same at best.

Packaging: 8/10
Same as DVDs. Some excellent limited edition sets (Don’t look now, Terminator 2 endoarm)

Total: 33/40

Hi-Vision Laserdisc:

Video Quality: 10/10
You had to buy a new generation TV to be able to watch these. Well ahead of its time.

Audio Quality: 8/10
Could technically have DTS and Ac-3 on the later releases.

Content: 3/10
Excellent choice of titles for a very small selection of 31 films. Other formats had hundreds of releases in their early few years compared to only 31 in 5 years for Hi-Vision LD. Market share literally zero point zero zero zero one.

Packaging: 9/10
Excellent packaging with the exception of Jumanji which came in a standard LD jacket. Very sturdy and protective digibook packaging on almost all titles. These were literally all special/limited edition releases but no crazy collector’s edition release with props and memorabilia.

Total: 30/40

VCD:

Video Quality: 1/10
Terrible video for any time.

Audio Quality: 1/10
Terrible audio period.

Content: 10/10
Virtually every film and much larger world wide market share than any other format.

Packaging: 5/5
Very protective but least interesting packaging. There might be some interesting box sets out there.

Total: 17/40

HD-DVD:

Video Quality:9/10
Same as Blu-ray.

Audio Quality: 9/10
Same as Blu-ray except more release opted for lossy Dolby Digital Plus instead of lossless Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD-MA. Probably because of lesser storage capacity (30GB vs 50GB for BD) otherwise supported all audio formats

Content: 8/10
More impressive titles were coming out on HD-DVD and had more Collector’s edition sets (Forbidden Planet, Harry Potter Set). Very impressive (about) 400 titles in only 3 years. Initially it was outselling Blu-ray too until very last few months. Lost major studio support and suffered a very quick unexpected death.

Packaging: 8/10
Same as DVDs

Total: 34/40

VHS:

Video Quality: 5/10
it was half of the available TV resolution on its release and fell miserably behind towards the end. 5 /10 is more than fair.

Audio Quality: 6/10
Excellent audio for starters but well behind competition after only a few years.

Content: 10/10
Anyone to argue this?

Packaging: 8/10

Later plastic boxes are super sturdy but most had paper cases. Can have a very lovely art work and collectable visual for many. Super fancy collectors set with prop/memorabilia were perhaps realized well after it lost its dominance.

Total: 29/40

HD-VMD:

Video Quality: 8/10
Same resolution as Blu-rays and HD-DVDs but much lower bitrates. It was marketed a cheaper alternative to Blu-rays and HD-DVDs while the format war was going on.

Audio Quality: 2/10
It is not clear if the format had the rights to use other codecs but all releases seem to have lossy Dolby Digital 2.0 audio. This only best VCD.

Content: 2/10
Nearly no films and no one has even heard of the format.

Packaging: 5/10
Same as Blu-rays. No known special editions.

Total: 17/40

Ranking:
Blu-ray: 34
HD-DVD: 34
4K UltraHD Blu-ray: 33
Laserdiscs: 32
DVD: 31
Hi-Vision Laserdisc: 30
VHS: 29
D-Theater: 28
HD-VMD: 17
VCD: 17
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 08:04 
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Pretty much exactly what Zeta said, but I also have the complete collection of GBA video, and I'd probably put them below VCD and CED.

Quality is so artifacted it's insane, audio is tinny at best, and don't get me started on the Shrek/Shark Tale combo cart, that thing looks worse than watching the movie play out as a flipbook.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 08:58 
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 09:30 
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pokefraker wrote:
Pretty much exactly what Zeta said, but I also have the complete collection of GBA video, and I'd probably put them below VCD and CED.

Quality is so artifacted it's insane, audio is tinny at best, and don't get me started on the Shrek/Shark Tale combo cart, that thing looks worse than watching the movie play out as a flipbook.


That reminds me, does anybody know if there's a complete list of UMD-Video (PSP) releases?
I mean all regional variants with ID.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 12:39 
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deadlegion wrote:
pokefraker wrote:
Pretty much exactly what Zeta said, but I also have the complete collection of GBA video, and I'd probably put them below VCD and CED.

Quality is so artifacted it's insane, audio is tinny at best, and don't get me started on the Shrek/Shark Tale combo cart, that thing looks worse than watching the movie play out as a flipbook.


That reminds me, does anybody know if there's a complete list of UMD-Video (PSP) releases?
I mean all regional variants with ID.


Wouldn't mind seeing this as well, I only have a couple I snagged from the Bargain bin ages ago, I'm surprised it's not on LDDB, it seemed like a pretty niche format, or at least on par with HD-DVD.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 15:43 
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Sounds like Substance has really tried them all.

Zeta's point about the fbi warnings and what not has long been a pet peeve of mine. It was probably at its absolute worst on DVD when they put s****y anti-piracy ads on them. I bought the movie ffs. If I wanted to pirate it, I wouldn't be watching this anti-piracy ad and wasting my time. Kind of ironic...

My rankings

LD/BD: My top choices. Audio is excellent on both. BD is really perfect for audio, you can put basically whatever you want on there. Usually I go for the cheaper of the two as long as the BD isn't mangled in some way. Some weird corner cases where I prefer LD as well, or just want the LD.

DVD: Dirt cheap now is the main selling point. Audio frequently isn't great. For most people it will look better than LD on a modern display but I prefer the look of LD especially on CRT.

VHS: Last resort for things not available elsewhere.

VCD/UMD: Hell no.

I'm sure 4K is fine, it sounds like super BD but I don't have a set-up for it so I can't comment on it.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 17:27 
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Only those with personal experience:

1) UHD BD: Well; have the player but atm seeing anything 4K down-scaled and non-HDR. Atmos/DTS:X/Auro but in the current room no hope of realising these so just not interested. Only beats BD since it has to be better right???

2) BD: Finally we get what was promised as a replacement for LD. Releases often compromised by excessive DNR (and multiple titles highlighted with colour timing issues) but when done right this format can really shine.

3) MUSE/Hi-Vision LD: Love this early HD analoguey/digitalish technology. Lots of potential but mostly a victim of that transition period from analogue to digital. Possibly the first discrete multi-channel audio home video format?

4) LaserDisc: No explanation needed. Better PQ (but not sound) may be found below, but it's just not the same.

5) W-VHS: Ok so sneaking this one in due to my appreciation of early analogue HD. Only two official pre-recorded releases I'm aware of other than the "Captain" releases discussed here: https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2653&view=next BTW if you have any of those Captain tapes I'm interested. Limited bandwidth for analogue HD so perhaps better thought of as ED? Potential for better PQ than DVD (though with analogue noise) but not as good as MUSE LD (well realistically in those reduced resolution slow panning shots more so the same). Again a victim of the quick transition from analogue to digital HD with only 2 consumer models before D-VHS replaced it. Excellent VHS Hi-Fi sound (with the assistance of metal tape).

6) DVD: Cheap, easy. no side flips, massive catalogue. in many respects perhaps the ultimate home format so far?? I used to work in a Hi-Fi shop. The number of times I heard of LD "When they can fit that on a CD I'll buy it" - no surprise to me how quickly DVD killed both VHS and LD. Still it always seemed like a somewhat inadequate successor to LD (not so much to VHS). Very often sh!tty sound codecs for music videos.

7) VHS/Beta: Just lumping them together because unlike the above don't use them any more and can't be bothered with 'that' argument very much. With my own eyes, in the PAL market Beta definitely had the edge over VHS but it seems that was lesser for NTSC (especially on run time) and even then for PAL narrowed over time.

8) VCD: I saw a few VCD's. They were sh!t; and that's being nice....

Just got my first VHD player a couple of weeks ago. Basically only for the sake of checking out the earliest home format with "true" 3D - first disc yet to arrive so no ranking!
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2019, 22:04 
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pokefraker wrote:
deadlegion wrote:
pokefraker wrote:
Pretty much exactly what Zeta said, but I also have the complete collection of GBA video, and I'd probably put them below VCD and CED.

Quality is so artifacted it's insane, audio is tinny at best, and don't get me started on the Shrek/Shark Tale combo cart, that thing looks worse than watching the movie play out as a flipbook.


That reminds me, does anybody know if there's a complete list of UMD-Video (PSP) releases?
I mean all regional variants with ID.


Wouldn't mind seeing this as well, I only have a couple I snagged from the Bargain bin ages ago, I'm surprised it's not on LDDB, it seemed like a pretty niche format, or at least on par with HD-DVD.


These aren’t really video formats. They’re just licensed doodads that work with one machine.

I too would like to see a list of every UMD video title since there are probably loads I’ve never seen, but only for curiosity. I already have a couple of the things and never watch the stuff. They look OK on the PSP screen but the output is terrible. They are region locked too (to the *drive*, not anything else in the PSP). They look great in the case...that’s about it. A confusingly bad idea for a format, even for Sony who has a history of failing to subside off eating its own lunch in this way.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2019, 00:19 
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signofzeta wrote:
These aren’t really video formats. They’re just licensed doodads that work with one machine.

I too would like to see a list of every UMD video title since there are probably loads I’ve never seen, but only for curiosity. I already have a couple of the things and never watch the stuff. They look OK on the PSP screen but the output is terrible. They are region locked too (to the *drive*, not anything else in the PSP). They look great in the case...that’s about it. A confusingly bad idea for a format, even for Sony who has a history of failing to subside off eating its own lunch in this way.


H.264 MPEG-4 AVC with ATRAC3plus audio. 900MB SL or 1.8GB DL discs.

Because of the format capacity you should only see one audio track but subtitle options should be available depending on the regional variant (subtitles off is also an option).

I only have 3 releases myself atm and yeah the boxes do have DVD region codes (one is R4 AU but the other 2 are R2 EU). There aren't PAL and NTSC discs though afaik, they should be all 720×480.
I've read that some UMD-Video releases aren't region locked, eg there are some Doctor Who releases (R2 UK only I believe) that apparently play on EU and US consoles. I know that my 2x R2 (Nordisk Film) releases work on both of my Aussie PSP consoles and also my Asian console (not Japanese).

As for only working on one machine that has the appropriate UMD drive, yes this is true for the physical disc, but if you make a 1:1 dump of the disc it should be technically possible to play the iso on a PSP with CFW, maybe a hacked PS TV (the Vita box thing without a screen) and possibly even a PS3 with CFW. Although the latter has less PSP compatibility, both of the last 2 options should give you better video output via hdmi. Should also work via an emulator on a PC but I wouldn't know about this myself.

Because movies/tv shows released on this format are available on other formats with better a/v quality and also more menu/extras options, most people wouldn't care. But there is at least one UMD-Video I know of that isn't a game and isn't a movie/tv show (I'm curious if there are any others)...
https://silenthill.fandom.com/wiki/The_ ... Experience
http://www.silenthillmemories.net/she/info_en.htm
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2019, 09:59 
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These are the formats that I have had a lot of experience with up until now:

1.) Blu Ray

Picture and audio quality - 10/10 // Excellent video and audio quality. It was such a huge upgrade compared to its predecessor DVD. I have seen many Blu Rays that look
great on my Benq 4K projector such as various Criterion Collection releases. Even in 10 or 20 years this format will still look very good.

2. Laserdisc

Picture quality was excellent for its time however it also greatly depended on its master. I have seen many laserdiscs that hardly look better than a VHS tape because
a lousy master was used for them. Picture quality of many late laserdisc releases is impressive compared to earlier releases. Many Criterion look very good and there are many
nice video to laserdisc transfers out there.

4:3 video using the full resolution of a laserdisc can look better than its DVD counterpart. There are some great looking music discs, for instance.
I nonetheless believe that DVD video usually looks considerably better especially if the movie was shot at 2,35:1 ( because DVDs are usually anamorphic whereas laserdiscs
are not ). If the video was a bit norrower, let's say 1,66:1 or 1,85:1 then I would not see that much of a difference even though it is still clearly visible.

Overall audio quality is excellent and can still keep up with modern formats such as Blu Ray and Ultra HD Blu Ray. I even have some Laserdiscs in my collection than
sound better than their Blu Ray counterparts.

3. DVD

Video quality wise I think this is a huge improvement over laserdisc if it was well mastered. Those Superbit releases, for instance, looked great. DVD even looks
OK if properly upscaled on my 4K projector at home.

Audio quality wise it can be as good as a laserdisc however PCM 2.0 is rarely encountered on DVD except for music and anime titles.
Most DVD releases use Dolby Digital 2.0 which I believe sounds way inferior to PCM 2.0. I hate DD 2.0. It has no life and simply sounds flat. Therefore if there is a film that has never made it to Blu Ray I usually
try to watch it on laserdisc because audio is just as important as video to me.

4. Video CD

I have seen many Video CDs in my life. Audio quality isn't that bad ( MP2 @ 224 kbit/s ). I have many German Video CD releases from the 90s. You can see that Philips was trying
to squeeze the maximum out of this format. Audio is usually quite good on these releases and video is acceptable if 4:3.
I like the format nonetheless because it has a vast catalogue of titles ( especially in places such as Hong Kong or Thailand ). I have a Video CD ( Hero, movie with Jet Li ) from Hong Kong
that is by far the best looking VCD I have ever seen in my life. We watched it on a 16:9 widescreen TV back then and thought it was acceptable.

5. VHS

Picture quality is OK if the source material was 4:3 video. There are still some interesting VHS only music titles out there ( Jean-Michel Jarre - The China Concerts, for example, or
Jean-Michel Jarre - Destination Docklands - The London Concert ). Audio quality can be excellent ( in my view ). VHS Hi-Fi Stereo has great dynamics.

6. UHD Disc

I have a UHD player and am very impressed with the overall picture quality. This is a huge improvement over Blu Ray and the level of detail encountered in Blade Runner
is just amazing.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2019, 23:29 
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Hot damn, substance, I knew I was going to lag behind many of the posters here but this is absurd.

#1 DVD. Yep, the plebeian choice. Honestly I think these look perfect: very little DNR or edge enhancement, later and CGI based movies such as Lost in Space or The Fifth Element have no need for BluRay's PQ upgrade, color is always accurate, and aliasing is minor--exceptionally so compared to LD.
Audio is usually 5.1 which is fine for me.
It's also very sturdy, surviving scuffs and minor scratches.
Enormous catalogue.

#2 LD. LDs are fun, I can tell I'll wind up with more than I can justify. Good image quality, attractive sound from an era where it was treated passionately, and a fairly strong library.
It still makes a great tweener format for DVD/Blu that are unattainable or unaffordable, with the bonus of skirting a number of annoying modern practices and potential surprises.
The only format to make me care about the packaging aesthetics.

#3 BD. I'm not taking the long view here, or this would be VHS. The pluses here are sometimes awesome image quality and sound. The caveats being the necessity of researching DNR, EE, and random who-knows for every title; then on top of that rejiggered sound. The constant minuses being awful startups through logo hell and obnoxious menus.
Frequenly the PQ isn't meaningfully better than the DVD's. It's sweet to finally get the perfect version of a favorite movie. Getting a merely good version of a merely good movie is like shaking more salt on a reheated dinner.
Crappy packaging also rears its head: those hypocritical plastic-saver cases are fragile.
Lastly, the films being made during BluRay's ascendancy very rarely interest me.

#4. VHS. It had everything but who wants to revisit it? I'd remember it much more fondly if two players hadn't mysteriously and promptly broken. The tapes at least bordered on indestructible. Great at the time for rentals and taping TV.
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2019, 23:45 
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You must be buying the wrong Blu-Rays. All of mine are a massive upgrade over any previous release. You have to screw up a BR pretty bad for it to not look better than a DVD, even if the source is horrible, because the overall bandwidth is so wide you can fit anything you want in there. DVD can’t even keep up with its own resolution, visibly macroblocking as its reach exceeds its grasp.

That thing Substance said about how LD has enough picture data to match any display of the time...DVD doesn’t always do that. Actually, since it has to be stretched to fit, anamorphic or not, it may be correct to say that it never does unless the player does massive after treatment.

IMO concerns for edge enhancement and DNR are massively overblown and based on mostly a few high profile screwups of major movies. There are at least as many bad LDs as bad BRs and I’ve seen soooooo many bad DVD releases it’s disgusting.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2019, 00:01 
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I've got the early Highlander BD release (region A/B) that's probably the only truly horrible looking release I have on that format (well, that I can think of atm). Yeah I know there's a newer better transfer.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2019, 01:33 
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snipesbackhand wrote:
Hot damn, substance, I knew I was going to lag behind many of the posters here but this is absurd.

#1 DVD. Yep, the plebeian choice. Honestly I think these look perfect: very little DNR or edge enhancement, later and CGI based movies such as Lost in Space or The Fifth Element have no need for BluRay's PQ upgrade, color is always accurate, and aliasing is minor--exceptionally so compared to LD.
Audio is usually 5.1 which is fine for me.
It's also very sturdy, surviving scuffs and minor scratches.
Enormous catalogue.

#2 LD. LDs are fun, I can tell I'll wind up with more than I can justify. Good image quality, attractive sound from an era where it was treated passionately, and a fairly strong library.
It still makes a great tweener format for DVD/Blu that are unattainable or unaffordable, with the bonus of skirting a number of annoying modern practices and potential surprises.
The only format to make me care about the packaging aesthetics.

#3 BD. I'm not taking the long view here, or this would be VHS. The pluses here are sometimes awesome image quality and sound. The caveats being the necessity of researching DNR, EE, and random who-knows for every title; then on top of that rejiggered sound. The constant minuses being awful startups through logo hell and obnoxious menus.
Frequenly the PQ isn't meaningfully better than the DVD's. It's sweet to finally get the perfect version of a favorite movie. Getting a merely good version of a merely good movie is like shaking more salt on a reheated dinner.
Crappy packaging also rears its head: those hypocritical plastic-saver cases are fragile.
Lastly, the films being made during BluRay's ascendancy very rarely interest me.

#4. VHS. It had everything but who wants to revisit it? I'd remember it much more fondly if two players hadn't mysteriously and promptly broken. The tapes at least bordered on indestructible. Great at the time for rentals and taping TV.


I actually have like 20-25 UMD discs, some DIVX discs and a few VHDs. I didn’t include these because my experience is very limited. DIVX discs are actually a marked improvement over VCDs but just too late to arrive. UMDs were not designed for large displays but a tiny PSP display. I think they are more than adequate.


I believe this teal and blue tinting, noise reduction, ee and contrast boost are not because of the newer formats but due to progress. if LD survived to this day, those releases would get similar treatments. These are all added (or removed) from the picture on the editing tools used, not because of the physical characteristics or the nature of the formats. So perhaps you like the old school mastering versus the new era.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2019, 01:44 
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signofzeta wrote:
You must be buying the wrong Blu-Rays. All of mine are a massive upgrade over any previous release. You have to screw up a BR pretty bad for it to not look better than a DVD, even if the source is horrible, because the overall bandwidth is so wide you can fit anything you want in there. DVD can’t even keep up with its own resolution, visibly macroblocking as its reach exceeds its grasp.

That thing Substance said about how LD has enough picture data to match any display of the time...DVD doesn’t always do that. Actually, since it has to be stretched to fit, anamorphic or not, it may be correct to say that it never does unless the player does massive after treatment.

IMO concerns for edge enhancement and DNR are massively overblown and based on mostly a few high profile screwups of major movies. There are at least as many bad LDs as bad BRs and I’ve seen soooooo many bad DVD releases it’s disgusting.


In 1999, there were ED (Enhanced Resolution) displays with 480p resolution and very few 768p Plasma displays. No physical media to support any of these but some very limited HD broadcasts. So at the end of LD era, the display technology had some minor improvements. LD had about 20 years where it literally satisfied every TV out there. Can’t say the same for DVDs. A couple years after its start, ED and some HD TVs appeared (as mentioned above) and a decade later Full HD (1080p) TVs were not so uncommon. Also a new HD format emerged (D-Theater). Another decade later, we had 4K UHD discs and 4K displays.

I think LD today on a modern TV looks crap but I took this above info in mind and tried to be fair. Back in 1980, I would have loved LD picture and in 2001 I was still more than satisfied with it. In 1997, I was blown away with the picture of DVD but stopped buying them after 2006 to never look back again. I upgraded all my LDs and DVDs to Blu-ray and 4K UHD over the years. There are some D-Theater tapes that I felt the picture quality was still adequate today and skipped on the Blu-ray upgrade. Same goes for HD-DVDs.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2019, 02:20 
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RE Blu talk

I'm with Zeta on a lot of it. BD slaughters DVD. It is somewhat annoying to have to research multiple releases and sometimes you get a movie only for a far superior release (on the same format, not counting 4K releases) to come out, which is disappointing. Thankfully that's only happened to me a few times with the most recent being The Princess Bride when Criterion put out their release of it.

But also

snipesbackhand wrote:
Crappy packaging also rears its head: those hypocritical plastic-saver cases are fragile.
Lastly, the films being made during BluRay's ascendancy very rarely interest me.


Yes.

substance wrote:
I actually have like 20-25 UMD discs, some DIVX discs and a few VHDs. I didn’t include these because my experience is very limited. DIVX discs are actually a marked improvement over VCDs but just too late to arrive. UMDs were not designed for large displays but a tiny PSP display. I think they are more than adequate.


The real question is why would anyone want to watch a movie on a tiny PSP screen. It's no surprise to me that even as PSP games continued, movie UMDs fizzled out.

Anyway, I appreciated your breakdown. I've never even tried some of the formats.

substance wrote:
I think LD today on a modern TV looks crap but I took this above info in mind and tried to be fair. Back in 1980, I would have loved LD picture and in 2001 I was still more than satisfied with it. In 1997, I was blown away with the picture of DVD but stopped buying them after 2006 to never look back again. I upgraded all my LDs and DVDs to Blu-ray and 4K UHD over the years. There are some D-Theater tapes that I felt the picture quality was still adequate today and skipped on the Blu-ray upgrade. Same goes for HD-DVDs.


I've never been happy with LD or VHS on modern displays. Thankfully, I've got an HD CRT in reserve.

deadlegion wrote:
I've got the early Highlander BD release (region A/B) that's probably the only truly horrible looking release I have on that format (well, that I can think of atm). Yeah I know there's a newer better transfer.


The anniversary release is glorious and cheap. I recommend it.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2019, 02:45 
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gypsy wrote:
RE Blu talk

I'm with Zeta on a lot of it. BD slaughters DVD. It is somewhat annoying to have to research multiple releases and sometimes you get a movie only for a far superior release (on the same format, not counting 4K releases) to come out, which is disappointing. Thankfully that's only happened to me a few times with the most recent being The Princess Bride when Criterion put out their release of it.

But also

snipesbackhand wrote:
Crappy packaging also rears its head: those hypocritical plastic-saver cases are fragile.
Lastly, the films being made during BluRay's ascendancy very rarely interest me.


Yes.

substance wrote:
I actually have like 20-25 UMD discs, some DIVX discs and a few VHDs. I didn’t include these because my experience is very limited. DIVX discs are actually a marked improvement over VCDs but just too late to arrive. UMDs were not designed for large displays but a tiny PSP display. I think they are more than adequate.


The real question is why would anyone want to watch a movie on a tiny PSP screen. It's no surprise to me that even as PSP games continued, movie UMDs fizzled out.

Anyway, I appreciated your breakdown. I've never even tried some of the formats.

substance wrote:
I think LD today on a modern TV looks crap but I took this above info in mind and tried to be fair. Back in 1980, I would have loved LD picture and in 2001 I was still more than satisfied with it. In 1997, I was blown away with the picture of DVD but stopped buying them after 2006 to never look back again. I upgraded all my LDs and DVDs to Blu-ray and 4K UHD over the years. There are some D-Theater tapes that I felt the picture quality was still adequate today and skipped on the Blu-ray upgrade. Same goes for HD-DVDs.


I've never been happy with LD or VHS on modern displays. Thankfully, I've got an HD CRT in reserve.

deadlegion wrote:
I've got the early Highlander BD release (region A/B) that's probably the only truly horrible looking release I have on that format (well, that I can think of atm). Yeah I know there's a newer better transfer.


The anniversary release is glorious and cheap. I recommend it.



This was probably around 2006, they were blowing away UMD movies at the gamestops. I think it was $5 per titles all brand new. $5 for a brand new disc in any format was a sweet deal but I wouldn’t be as excited today even for 4K UHD discs. I bought 20-25 to watch them on the airplane on my trips to Europe. I remember I watched Bad Boys 2 on the flight. Back then there was the original iphone but I don’t know if it supporter ripped movies. I had a Nokia E90 communicator with a 4” amoled screen. I could rip DVDs and play them from microSD cards. PSP experience was markly better and convenient (no need to rip, better encodes). I think it was a great idea at the time for people who traveled and needed something portable.
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 Post subject: Re: Rank the home media hard copyformats you're experienced
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2019, 02:51 
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Oh I didn't mean to question why you bought them. I bought some too, all dirt cheap as well as a curiosity. I just meant in general, watching movies on such a small screen is unpleasant.
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